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    All Forums | Boxing

    Juan Diaz vs Paulie Malignaggi (Outcome)

    Pinkerton
    TorontoJoey
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    Pinkerton
    Pinkerton
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    Joined: Aug, 2009
    Posts: 4
    Posted: Aug. 23, 2009 - 5:14 PM ET #1

     Post fight write-up.
    Yesterday I was going to post to play Malignaggi to win by decision (or straight out +400 in case of a cut or other stoppage). Then I realized a fatal mistake I made before in a rematch fight. Both fighters were so highly ranked many years ago that a somewhat close fight would go to the fighter who lost the first fight to set-up a big payday trilogy. I overlooked that factor in the past.
    Last night you had Juan Diaz who is a marketable commodity and Malignaggi who is not a box office draw. The reasons are simple, Malignaggi fights a style where he doesn't run, but doesn't bring that action many fight fans love, a war of punishment and knockouts. Diaz although consider a small puncher for his class, still brings constant pressure and can exhaust many fighters and get a late round knockout.
    Even though this fight wasn't even close to the fight I had in the past, it was still about big money. Most have heard the rule, where there is money to be made, there will be (possible) cheating. Regardless of the outcome (even though not fair to Malinaggi), both fighters actualy gain. Diaz keeps a win on his somewhat tarnishing image, and Malinaggi gets praise.
    The only post I was going to place was don't bet Diaz -450 (or higher on most places). I though just because of the style that Malignaggi would perform to win a small decision. In a case where there isn't a knockout, there are other factors. It first started out against Malignaggi when they made it an 18-ft ring. Then the two texan judges and the texan referee.At last we come to the 138.5lbs weigh-in. This is common among smaller or bigger fighters who are the bigger draw, or champion to make the fighter closer to their natural weight, to make it difficult for the opposition physically as well as I mental frustration.
    I thought (and was lucky if it went according to many scorecards) a 115-113 Malignaggi victory. I also consiered the split decision factor. It was a close fight and if Diaz won a majority draw, I couldn't have a strong arguement for Malignaggi. That wasn't the case as we know, it was 118-110 in one judges score. That's the factor where I couldn't bet the fight either way. The over seemed likely but laying -250 over 11.5 rounds is always too risky. Anything from, DQ, cuts, swelling, and on and on could cause an early stop to the fight.
    So, in point, besides the obvious, I had one thing to post. Don't bet Diaz (in the case of bad judges, crooked, etc). That was my mistake yesterday to the forum. Losing a wager like that is just as costly (and more depending on your wager and odds) as winning a wager.
    It was a matter of styles and it was highly likely going to be a close fight. At 4-1 I will always take a 50-50 chance, or even a 60-40. In this case, too many factors relied on Diaz winning... MONEY!
    For those that bet Malignaggi and lost: You had the right play at the wrong time (and that is important, considering the referee and judges, I estimated it to be a little more than Diaz -300. For those who bet Diaz, congratualations on a win. If you considered the possible bad juding factor, it wasn't a horrific play. If you didn't, consider yourself lucky on this one.
     
    "Adversity causes some men to break, others to break records."
    William A. Ward
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
     Post fight write-up.
    Yesterday I was going to post to play Malignaggi to win by decision (or straight out +400 in case of a cut or other stoppage). Then I realized a fatal mistake I made before in a rematch fight. Both fighters were so highly ranked many years ago that a somewhat close fight would go to the fighter who lost the first fight to set-up a big payday trilogy. I overlooked that factor in the past.
    Last night you had Juan Diaz who is a marketable commodity and Malignaggi who is not a box office draw. The reasons are simple, Malignaggi fights a style where he doesn't run, but doesn't bring that action many fight fans love, a war of punishment and knockouts. Diaz although consider a small puncher for his class, still brings constant pressure and can exhaust many fighters and get a late round knockout.
    Even though this fight wasn't even close to the fight I had in the past, it was still about big money. Most have heard the rule, where there is money to be made, there will be (possible) cheating. Regardless of the outcome (even though not fair to Malinaggi), both fighters actualy gain. Diaz keeps a win on his somewhat tarnishing image, and Malinaggi gets praise.
    The only post I was going to place was don't bet Diaz -450 (or higher on most places). I though just because of the style that Malignaggi would perform to win a small decision. In a case where there isn't a knockout, there are other factors. It first started out against Malignaggi when they made it an 18-ft ring. Then the two texan judges and the texan referee.At last we come to the 138.5lbs weigh-in. This is common among smaller or bigger fighters who are the bigger draw, or champion to make the fighter closer to their natural weight, to make it difficult for the opposition physically as well as I mental frustration.
    I thought (and was lucky if it went according to many scorecards) a 115-113 Malignaggi victory. I also consiered the split decision factor. It was a close fight and if Diaz won a majority draw, I couldn't have a strong arguement for Malignaggi. That wasn't the case as we know, it was 118-110 in one judges score. That's the factor where I couldn't bet the fight either way. The over seemed likely but laying -250 over 11.5 rounds is always too risky. Anything from, DQ, cuts, swelling, and on and on could cause an early stop to the fight.
    So, in point, besides the obvious, I had one thing to post. Don't bet Diaz (in the case of bad judges, crooked, etc). That was my mistake yesterday to the forum. Losing a wager like that is just as costly (and more depending on your wager and odds) as winning a wager.
    It was a matter of styles and it was highly likely going to be a close fight. At 4-1 I will always take a 50-50 chance, or even a 60-40. In this case, too many factors relied on Diaz winning... MONEY!
    For those that bet Malignaggi and lost: You had the right play at the wrong time (and that is important, considering the referee and judges, I estimated it to be a little more than Diaz -300. For those who bet Diaz, congratualations on a win. If you considered the possible bad juding factor, it wasn't a horrific play. If you didn't, consider yourself lucky on this one.
     
    "Adversity causes some men to break, others to break records."
    William A. Ward
     
    TorontoJoey
    TorontoJoey
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    Joined: Jan, 2009
    Posts: 23609
    Posted: Aug. 23, 2009 - 6:18 PM ET #2

    DIAZ LOOKED GOOD. 
    Reply
    DIAZ LOOKED GOOD. 
     
    Pinkerton
    Pinkerton
    Prospect
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    Joined: Aug, 2009
    Posts: 4
    Posted: Aug. 24, 2009 - 1:40 AM ET #3

    Yes, he did. I feel Malignaggi won by a close decision. Realisitcally, Diaz doesn't have the abilities to fight with the best in his weight class. He's not a quitter, he's aggressive, he's a solid inside fighter. He's lacks power, ring savy, ability to circle and punch, and all around top weight class boxing ability. He's solid, and a come and go champion against the right opponents. He can wear down opponents that attempt to go non-stop with him that lack power punches. I don't feel agree as write-ups posted he has a suspect chin. Marquez blasted him, and he is tenacious as any fighter in the world.
    Look at the fight if you have time another time. Don't look at just one fighter, be objective as you can. Tell me the score you get. Yes Diaz gets agression rounds, but those are rounds where nobody actually does much. Malignaggi hit him enough the rounds he won and kept him at arms length half the fight with a strong jab for ten rounds, althought it got soft in the last two rounds.
    For instance, take the old fight of Trinidad De La Hoya. Trinidad was the aggessor, for the majority. That fight there was less solid punches than this fight, and for good reason. De La Hoya didn't want to go to sleep. That was a very close fight. At the the time I bet Trinidad and was forutnate to get the decision. I felt there should have been a rematch, because neither fighter effectively dominated most rounds, or won decively enough on many rounds. Many experts and media feel De La Hoya won easily.
    Watch Livingstone Bramble vs Oba Carr in 1991 for a controverial fight. Hometown decision, and Oba had a big fight with De La Hoya coming up. Similar to De La Hoya vs Strum 2004. De la Hoya won another contrversial fight, and he had a huge upcoming payday with Hopkins.
    Just some thoughts!
     
    "The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy."
    Martin Luther King, Jr.
    Reply
    Yes, he did. I feel Malignaggi won by a close decision. Realisitcally, Diaz doesn't have the abilities to fight with the best in his weight class. He's not a quitter, he's aggressive, he's a solid inside fighter. He's lacks power, ring savy, ability to circle and punch, and all around top weight class boxing ability. He's solid, and a come and go champion against the right opponents. He can wear down opponents that attempt to go non-stop with him that lack power punches. I don't feel agree as write-ups posted he has a suspect chin. Marquez blasted him, and he is tenacious as any fighter in the world.
    Look at the fight if you have time another time. Don't look at just one fighter, be objective as you can. Tell me the score you get. Yes Diaz gets agression rounds, but those are rounds where nobody actually does much. Malignaggi hit him enough the rounds he won and kept him at arms length half the fight with a strong jab for ten rounds, althought it got soft in the last two rounds.
    For instance, take the old fight of Trinidad De La Hoya. Trinidad was the aggessor, for the majority. That fight there was less solid punches than this fight, and for good reason. De La Hoya didn't want to go to sleep. That was a very close fight. At the the time I bet Trinidad and was forutnate to get the decision. I felt there should have been a rematch, because neither fighter effectively dominated most rounds, or won decively enough on many rounds. Many experts and media feel De La Hoya won easily.
    Watch Livingstone Bramble vs Oba Carr in 1991 for a controverial fight. Hometown decision, and Oba had a big fight with De La Hoya coming up. Similar to De La Hoya vs Strum 2004. De la Hoya won another contrversial fight, and he had a huge upcoming payday with Hopkins.
    Just some thoughts!
     
    "The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy."
    Martin Luther King, Jr.
     
    Pinkerton
    Pinkerton
    Prospect
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Aug, 2009
    Posts: 4
    Posted: Aug. 25, 2009 - 9:22 AM ET #4

    There have been some good posts regarding the fight outcome. Some of the best posts come out when an unfortunate situation happens, but we make the best of it and it helps us grow.
    NJDevils  (Malignaggi at the post fight presser) posted the same youtube post fight conference I have on My Space. Well done NJDevils . The link is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj1W1ruOdXc for those who haven't seen it.
    Good job to all the people who contributed some very solid posts regarding this fight (mainly regarding the injustice for many who give it their all and most end up with a sad story).
    Boxing is one of those sports that is probably worst in treating fighters during their career, and they very rarely get endorsements. Only the very elite (less than .1%) get any kind of significant return.
    Boxing is the ONLY sports that doesn't have a nationwide pension plan for retired athletes. The only state that has a pension is California. The statistics show that just under 90% of boxers end up with some kind of damage and many times it doesn't show immediately. I remembered when they first banned MMA because they said it was too brutal and violent. In the long term, MMA doesn't come close to the permanent and serious brain damage that boxers receive. I'm a fan of MMA but that doesn't change the fact.
    Boxing is not a sport you would want your children to partake in. The abuse they put their bodies (especially brain trauma) is bad enough. Add to the fact the politics and cheating, and these warriors don't get what they deserve.
    With all that said, and all the negative things, I'm still a big fan. I think it's the heart you see in fighters that really gets you.
    In closing and while on that note, a shot out to late Arturo Gatti . He epitomized what fight fans live for.
     
    "Courage is the ladder on which all the other virtues mount."
    Clare Booth Luce
    Reply
    There have been some good posts regarding the fight outcome. Some of the best posts come out when an unfortunate situation happens, but we make the best of it and it helps us grow.
    NJDevils  (Malignaggi at the post fight presser) posted the same youtube post fight conference I have on My Space. Well done NJDevils . The link is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj1W1ruOdXc for those who haven't seen it.
    Good job to all the people who contributed some very solid posts regarding this fight (mainly regarding the injustice for many who give it their all and most end up with a sad story).
    Boxing is one of those sports that is probably worst in treating fighters during their career, and they very rarely get endorsements. Only the very elite (less than .1%) get any kind of significant return.
    Boxing is the ONLY sports that doesn't have a nationwide pension plan for retired athletes. The only state that has a pension is California. The statistics show that just under 90% of boxers end up with some kind of damage and many times it doesn't show immediately. I remembered when they first banned MMA because they said it was too brutal and violent. In the long term, MMA doesn't come close to the permanent and serious brain damage that boxers receive. I'm a fan of MMA but that doesn't change the fact.
    Boxing is not a sport you would want your children to partake in. The abuse they put their bodies (especially brain trauma) is bad enough. Add to the fact the politics and cheating, and these warriors don't get what they deserve.
    With all that said, and all the negative things, I'm still a big fan. I think it's the heart you see in fighters that really gets you.
    In closing and while on that note, a shot out to late Arturo Gatti . He epitomized what fight fans live for.
     
    "Courage is the ladder on which all the other virtues mount."
    Clare Booth Luce
     
     
    TorontoJoey
    TorontoJoey
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    Joined: Jan, 2009
    Posts: 23609
    Posted: Aug. 26, 2009 - 8:17 PM ET #5

    Reply
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