Ortiz landed ZERO jabs (thrown 31) in 4 Rounds !!!

Larry Merchant is a joke to me (like Bert Sugar). Harold Lederman is accurate. Ortiz landed 0 for 31 jabs. Like I stated, Mayweather is natural master of defense, and that stat is huge because Ortiz is a southpaw but naturally a right handed fighter and he has a strong fast stiff jab. In just under twelve minutes of boxing he landed ZERO jabs. Even though in boxing is more subjective and you have to watch the fights, this fight you could have looked at one stat. Ortiz in his last 6 bouts averaged 13 jabs per round and landed less than 2 (11%), while Mayweather last 7 bouts average over 16 jabs per round and landed almost 7 (40.8%). Ortiz was now facing the premiere defensive boxer (Hopkins included) not a slugger or bum, why and how did people think he could win if he couldn't hit Floyd with a jab? Floyd didn't even have to anticipate punches because without the jab he saw them coming.
Heavyweight Champion Larry Holmes won 48 fights without a loss almost matching Rocky Marciano's record of 49-0 and he did it all with a jab. For non-boxers and laymen fans, the jab is both offense and defense and is the fundamental tool that makes offensive openings. A superoir jab keeps fighters at the distance you establish, throws them off rhythm, causes blind spots that creates openings and can cause swelling, cuts, welts, a mouse, a busted nose that causes breathing, mouth cuts which can leads to an overflow of blood swallowed, etc, etc... The point is simple, when you are facing a great fighter and naturally gifted defensive master, no jab means no victory.
Many people like Oscar were natural left handed and fought orthdox. As a lightweight, he was tall, fast, and strong with a moster jab that he used and basically won fights with his jab alone. Unfortunately as he moved up in weight, he didn't carry his power and lost speed. The jab he had at lightweight was so devastating only 2 of 20 fights went the distance (at lightweight or less) and if you watch the films he did it all with the jab. At light welterweight he destoryed Chavez who was 33 with a record 96-1-1 (only loss was split decision). Many people say Chavez was finished, he was past his prime and his body was in a hundred fights, but he was far from a push over but Oscar beat him like he was his daddy (4th round TKO) and then in the rematch as well. Oscar couldn't win against and equaled opponent at welterweight or higher. Lost close fights with Mosley, Trinidad, Mayweather and KOd by Hopkins and Pacquiao. He won a controversial fight against Sturm as a tune-up to Hopkins, but a fat looking Oscar was the fighter who got tuned up (you think the big PPV event with Hopkins next had any effect on the scorecards? lol).

Can you condense what are you trying to get across?

If you read the Topic, it speaks for itself. I just added some examples but I can try to keep it to 5 letter words maximum and 5 word sentences, but I won't. Next time don't bother with empty reply, just read the parts you understand.

Ortiz landed zero jabs, is your thesis. I got it...but what are you trying to get across? Are you trying to inform your reader that the jab is the single most important punch in boxing? Are you trying to say the jab is the foremost punch in defeating Mayweather? If so you could of gotten that through in less than 1000 words.

You wrote  a rambling display of known boxing knowledge on a gambling forum with modest boxing fans. What you did was write an essay on a GAMBLING FORUM after the fight. Where was this great essay BEFORE the fight. Just saying. Continue your POST MATCH essays. But I would love to saee your POST MATCH essays correlate into PRE MATCH essays that can help a gambler win money. You will garner the "respect" and following you are so desiring that way. Monday morning Quaterbacks dont garner respect...sorry

Smoke_O: Just check the posts. I clearly continued since the signing of the fight Ortiz had no chance. I was criticized and they wanted specific details, and I gave them. Look at past posts and you will clearly see I maybe commented on a half dozen threads on how Mayweather would dominate and most likely win inside the distance. I stated that laying -800 is never good as every week underdogs are winning that should have been favorites. Say that headbutt was accidental and stopped the fight, because they didn't complete 4 full rounds (sometimes the halfway mark in the 4th round) it would be a no-contest and I would lose any prop bet (I detailed dangers of betting that way) except a bet that included no-contest, where as a straight wager you would push. I'm sure if you want to take a look of threads I posted on, it will be clear exactly how I felt. I leave it up to you. I don't just post after, so read a few threads and don't worry if I don't get respect ... I actually get requests for wagers like a tout service would, only I don't advertise but they find me and that is the truth! Read my posts and ask me for an analysis of a fight you are going to possibly bet and I will give you a 10 page breakdown!

zouk's only three picks have been 

zab +400 over khan(loss)

over 7 rounds khan/zab(loss)

Quinton Jackson parlayed with thiago alves UFC(loss)

 

 

 

 

 

 

walk the line asked you for a breakdown of the pbf/ortiz fight and you never provided one. i had 12 to 1 pbf winning the fight from individual rounds 8-12 for one unit and five units pbf -260.

both odds were mistakes by my book caliente here in mexico of which i quickly bet on. the headbutt probably cost me 12 units if ortiz survived until the eighth.

you were so sure of pbf but you didn't wager anything? you didnt even bet on wk/haye in which every handicapper knew that the wk-210 was a bad line(i had wk for 20 units).

 

I knew and watched little on Haye. I avoid heavyweights as many are lazy and unpredictable. Actually, I did say Floyd and I believe a win ITD between 6-12 rounds.... I thought maybe cuts and swelling would have a good reason to stop as Ortiz was getting hit clean. I didn't buy into the 24/7 act Ortiz was revitalized, he quit before, and he quit again.

In Summation: Larry Merchant is a joke to you. Ortiz didn't land a much needed jab to help his cause in the fight with PBF. Oscar lost his speed and jab when he moved up in weight. TY 4 the tips.

Larry Merchant is a joke to boxing. Floyd Mayweather Jr should never been considered pound-for-pound greatest lists because he fought all 2nd rate with no chances. Dozen fighters over 5 years he could have fought, and I believe he beats most (if not all). So, your post BigPapa21 was a great summary... of what & why? Nevermind it's rhetorical but you may have thought it was for real!

Qncyk1: Try and read the posts and don't just take parts of posts and use them out of context. You can find a half dozen posts I state Ortiz can't win, so at +2000, what's the difference. Are you telling me I don't have a post saying Ortiz would get wrecked because he is so far out of his league it's HBO hype. You want a breakdown for a fight when a fighter is better in all categories. If you can't find a post regarding this, I can easily. Funny part is HBO had you so into the match-up that was never there. When I comment about career moves and so on in long thread that have real relevance, you get a few people complain. I guess that's why HBO 24/7 works well, people like the fake drama and BS entertainment and don't appreciate boxing as a sport an art.

Hey Zouk,  I'm on the otherside of the fence when you speak of larry merchant.  He always chooses his words carefully, and tho he speaks 2mph he's got a quick eye.  He sees all the little things boxers do.  He's old school and perhaps hes the wrong type of commentator for this era, but he sure beats Max Kellerman who rambles on way to much on a sport he doesn't know much about.  

I prefer Harold, Emanuel & Teddy for analysis pre-fight and during (post as well). I remember everyone saying it was his idea and speaking about the "Dream Match" of Oscar vs Manny. Oscar is to aged and had no shot especially at that weight. Now, you take Oscar in his prime vs Manny at lighweight, I take Oscar over almost anyone in history. His jab at that weight was fast and hard and destroyed opponents with one hand. Add the fact his height (even though he hunched) and reach and boxing ability. He lost that speed moving up, and had no power either. Although he was a natural southpaw he fought orthodox. I just think Merchant is a few steps above Bert Sugar. I never heard his opinion pre-fight or analysis other than repeating what fighters of managers stated. Max ten years ago really followed boxing close and had a decent eye, more exposure on ESPN and he lost sight. RJJ use to be great at fight breakdowns but not made for announcing.

SawLo: There is a thread on Larry Merchant and many people do like him (and it was a surprise to me). I'm curious to maybe a little more information as to what you think he brings to the table. Even a comparison to others would be cool as well. I respect everyone's opinion (although maybe not agree) and just wanted a little more to consider as I like views opposite of mine as it helps you really focus on overlooked facts, etc... Thanks!