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    All Forums | Politics

    Pandora papers, How the Rich get Richer

    joe pockets
    I_Need_A_Detox
    KellyM_1964
    shiek
    BigGame90
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    joe pockets
    joe pockets
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    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 10:23 AM ET #1

    The top income tax rate these days is 37 percent But do any 7 digit earners end up near this amount ? It must be nice to eat and cheat. Slice-and-dice it any way you like. The bottom-line is the very wealthy have gotten their kind of wealth exempted from taxes while most everyone else has to pay it. It would be nice if all these giants of Investment Business & Politics when step up make speech to there employees media or public “ Thank you for paying for the roads that got me here or Thank you for the safe  nation that I don’t remotely pay my fair share for as I yearly avoid! All these years Dems & Rep fight over every thing under the sun but not Tax reform & never make all accountable. 

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    The top income tax rate these days is 37 percent But do any 7 digit earners end up near this amount ? It must be nice to eat and cheat. Slice-and-dice it any way you like. The bottom-line is the very wealthy have gotten their kind of wealth exempted from taxes while most everyone else has to pay it. It would be nice if all these giants of Investment Business & Politics when step up make speech to there employees media or public “ Thank you for paying for the roads that got me here or Thank you for the safe  nation that I don’t remotely pay my fair share for as I yearly avoid! All these years Dems & Rep fight over every thing under the sun but not Tax reform & never make all accountable. 

     
    I_Need_A_Detox
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 1:10 PM ET #2

    The top 50% of all taxpayers paid 97 percent of all individual income taxes, while the bottom 50% paid the remaining 3% 

    The top 1% paid a greater share of individual income taxes (38.5%) than the bottom 90% combined (29.9%)

    How about they look for ways to cut spending instead of looking for ways to increase taxes? 

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    The top 50% of all taxpayers paid 97 percent of all individual income taxes, while the bottom 50% paid the remaining 3% 

    The top 1% paid a greater share of individual income taxes (38.5%) than the bottom 90% combined (29.9%)

    How about they look for ways to cut spending instead of looking for ways to increase taxes? 

     
    KellyM_1964
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 1:18 PM ET #3

    Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:

    The top income tax rate these days is 37 percent But do any 7 digit earners end up near this amount ? It must be nice to eat and cheat. Slice-and-dice it any way you like. The bottom-line is the very wealthy have gotten their kind of wealth exempted from taxes while most everyone else has to pay it. I

     

    thats a verifiable fact  peace_5

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:

    The top income tax rate these days is 37 percent But do any 7 digit earners end up near this amount ? It must be nice to eat and cheat. Slice-and-dice it any way you like. The bottom-line is the very wealthy have gotten their kind of wealth exempted from taxes while most everyone else has to pay it. I

     

    thats a verifiable fact  peace_5

     
    shiek
    shiek
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    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 2:52 PM ET #4

    The rich do pay the significant portion of the taxes but that doesn’t address the OP point that the rich are also able to dodge a significant amount of taxes due to the idiotic loopholes. The example I always use is a dr w 350k of revenue , thru schedule C self employed deductions, dependents and home interest is then able to qualify for the earned income credit where the govt is actually paying the doctor to work… ironically too 1 of the few things Trump did get right is the idea that taxpayers should foot the bill for anything over a 10,000 home interest deduction each yr is ridiculous. Taxes r still way 2 high , we should reduce spending, but the bottom line is the main culprit is still the ridiculous loopholes
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    The rich do pay the significant portion of the taxes but that doesn’t address the OP point that the rich are also able to dodge a significant amount of taxes due to the idiotic loopholes. The example I always use is a dr w 350k of revenue , thru schedule C self employed deductions, dependents and home interest is then able to qualify for the earned income credit where the govt is actually paying the doctor to work… ironically too 1 of the few things Trump did get right is the idea that taxpayers should foot the bill for anything over a 10,000 home interest deduction each yr is ridiculous. Taxes r still way 2 high , we should reduce spending, but the bottom line is the main culprit is still the ridiculous loopholes
     
    joe pockets
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    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 7:01 PM ET #5

    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Really ! 

    No, the process I’m speculating about goes like this:

    1. Bezos has $1000 of Amazon stock.
    2. Bezos contributes the stock to the LLC and receives in exchange 10 LLC units. This is a non-taxable event in a 1099 exchange. The LLC has no activity, assets, or liabilities other than holding the Amazon stock.
    3. Bezos find a bank that’s willing to lend him money to buy more interests in the LLC.
      This is an investment expense, so the interest will be deductible.
    4. Bezos borrows $900 from the bank and contributes it to the LLC. This is a capital contribution. In return, Bezos gets 9 more units. He posts all 19 units (100% of the outstanding units) to the bank as collateral on the loan.
    5. The LLC distributes his $900 capital contribution back to Bezos. A return of a capital contribution is not a taxable event. (Imagine for a moment you invested $100 in a restaurant. A year later, they go out of business, wind up their affairs, and return what’s left. By sheer coincidence, you get exactly $100 back. This is not taxable. You have realized no capital gain or loss, and there were no profits to distribute. You just get your own money back. That’s what Bezos is doing).

    So now, with the loan, Bezos has realized no gain or loss and he has $900 million in his pocket to spend however he would like. He’ll pay interest on $1 billion and that interest will be deductible against other income.

    So where did the Rich taxes go? They all do it.

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    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Really ! 

    No, the process I’m speculating about goes like this:

    1. Bezos has $1000 of Amazon stock.
    2. Bezos contributes the stock to the LLC and receives in exchange 10 LLC units. This is a non-taxable event in a 1099 exchange. The LLC has no activity, assets, or liabilities other than holding the Amazon stock.
    3. Bezos find a bank that’s willing to lend him money to buy more interests in the LLC.
      This is an investment expense, so the interest will be deductible.
    4. Bezos borrows $900 from the bank and contributes it to the LLC. This is a capital contribution. In return, Bezos gets 9 more units. He posts all 19 units (100% of the outstanding units) to the bank as collateral on the loan.
    5. The LLC distributes his $900 capital contribution back to Bezos. A return of a capital contribution is not a taxable event. (Imagine for a moment you invested $100 in a restaurant. A year later, they go out of business, wind up their affairs, and return what’s left. By sheer coincidence, you get exactly $100 back. This is not taxable. You have realized no capital gain or loss, and there were no profits to distribute. You just get your own money back. That’s what Bezos is doing).

    So now, with the loan, Bezos has realized no gain or loss and he has $900 million in his pocket to spend however he would like. He’ll pay interest on $1 billion and that interest will be deductible against other income.

    So where did the Rich taxes go? They all do it.

     
    BigGame90
    BigGame90
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    Joined: Oct, 2006
    Posts: 5069
    Posted: Oct. 4, 2021 - 7:37 PM ET #6

    @joe pockets

     Interesting Joe. Any idea why these billionaires are getting divorced this year (Bezos, Gates, would guess Zuck in a year)? Have a feeling it has something to do with taxes, stocks, getting out before capital gains increases...?

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    @joe pockets

     Interesting Joe. Any idea why these billionaires are getting divorced this year (Bezos, Gates, would guess Zuck in a year)? Have a feeling it has something to do with taxes, stocks, getting out before capital gains increases...?

     
     
    KellyM_1964
    KellyM_1964
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    Joined: May, 2009
    Posts: 16751
    Posted: Oct. 5, 2021 - 11:31 AM ET #7

    Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:

    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Really ! 

    No, the process I’m speculating about goes like this:

    1. Bezos has $1000 of Amazon stock.
    2. Bezos contributes the stock to the LLC and receives in exchange 10 LLC units. This is a non-taxable event in a 1099 exchange. The LLC has no activity, assets, or liabilities other than holding the Amazon stock.
    3. Bezos find a bank that’s willing to lend him money to buy more interests in the LLC.
      This is an investment expense, so the interest will be deductible.
    4. Bezos borrows $900 from the bank and contributes it to the LLC. This is a capital contribution. In return, Bezos gets 9 more units. He posts all 19 units (100% of the outstanding units) to the bank as collateral on the loan.
    5. The LLC distributes his $900 capital contribution back to Bezos. A return of a capital contribution is not a taxable event. (Imagine for a moment you invested $100 in a restaurant. A year later, they go out of business, wind up their affairs, and return what’s left. By sheer coincidence, you get exactly $100 back. This is not taxable. You have realized no capital gain or loss, and there were no profits to distribute. You just get your own money back. That’s what Bezos is doing).

    So now, with the loan, Bezos has realized no gain or loss and he has $900 million in his pocket to spend however he would like. He’ll pay interest on $1 billion and that interest will be deductible against other income.

    So where did the Rich taxes go? They all do it.

     

     

    very intresting     wasnt aware of those inner workings in that manner

     

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
    Reply
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    Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:

    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Really ! 

    No, the process I’m speculating about goes like this:

    1. Bezos has $1000 of Amazon stock.
    2. Bezos contributes the stock to the LLC and receives in exchange 10 LLC units. This is a non-taxable event in a 1099 exchange. The LLC has no activity, assets, or liabilities other than holding the Amazon stock.
    3. Bezos find a bank that’s willing to lend him money to buy more interests in the LLC.
      This is an investment expense, so the interest will be deductible.
    4. Bezos borrows $900 from the bank and contributes it to the LLC. This is a capital contribution. In return, Bezos gets 9 more units. He posts all 19 units (100% of the outstanding units) to the bank as collateral on the loan.
    5. The LLC distributes his $900 capital contribution back to Bezos. A return of a capital contribution is not a taxable event. (Imagine for a moment you invested $100 in a restaurant. A year later, they go out of business, wind up their affairs, and return what’s left. By sheer coincidence, you get exactly $100 back. This is not taxable. You have realized no capital gain or loss, and there were no profits to distribute. You just get your own money back. That’s what Bezos is doing).

    So now, with the loan, Bezos has realized no gain or loss and he has $900 million in his pocket to spend however he would like. He’ll pay interest on $1 billion and that interest will be deductible against other income.

    So where did the Rich taxes go? They all do it.

     

     

    very intresting     wasnt aware of those inner workings in that manner

     

     

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