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    All Forums | Systems & Strategies

    Baseball handicapping model

    curiousone
    doubledime
    ScreaminPain
    Participants:
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    Views: 1362
    Posts: 8
     
    curiousone
    curiousone
    Prospect
    Participation Meter
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    Posts: 257
    Posted: May. 6, 2011 - 11:08 AM ET #1

    I have used this model for several years, it has been fairly effective.  I want to see what opinions that others have about this model.  Are there other factors that you know are important?  Each of these factors is rated a % of an overall formula where all the %s add up to 100%.  The rating % goes down as the list number goes up.  In other words WHIP is the most important factor, ERA is the least important factor.

    One thing I want to say first.  The person that taught me how to cap this way did not believe in worrying about the opposing hitters except in the matchup between this game's starting pitcher.  I asked him about that and he said the difference between a .250 hitter and a .300 hitter is .2 hits per game.

    1.  WHIP
    2.  Starter's last outing - this is used as a knockout, if the starter got bombed his last game, don't play him at all.
    3.  HR per innings pitched (over 9 innings)
    4.  K vs BB over 9 innings.  You just do K/BB over 9 innings.
    5.  Atem pitch - an atem pitch is a pitch that gets hit hard, but hit right at someone.  In other words this would have been a double or a triple if it was not hit right at someone  I think the idea here is that this pitcher got very lucky on this pitch.
    6.  Relievers - Relief staff statistics over the last few weeks and against the opposing team. Narrowed down to the relievers who can actually pitch in this game.
    7.  Umpire - Some umpires favor the UNDER, some favor the OVER.  We want umpires that greatly favor the UNDER.  This is a good stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the UNDER, it is a bad stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the OVER.
    8.  Stadium - some stadiums are domes and don't really impact a team.  Other stadiums are open and the weather has a huge impact.  Or, the dimensions to the fence really matter for certain hitters.  Example, player A hits lots of home runs down the first base line in this park with the very short distance to the fence down the first base line, but he does not usually hit home runs down the first base line in more normal parks.
    9.  Weather - is it cold?  Does cold matter in this park?  Is it extremely hot and humid?  Is the wind blowing down the short fence in right field?
    10.  Hitting lineup vs starting pitcher - how does this starter fare vs these hitters.  A few years ago I was betting the Yankees, I forget the pitcher, anyway one of my friends said "that pitcher gets mauled by the hitters in the other team".   The Yankees got killed that game.
    11. IP per start - will the starter go 7 innings?  5 innings?  9 innings?  We want starters who will go 7 innings.  6.3 innings and above is good.  6.0 is okay. Below 6 is bad.
    12. ERA - this is a very small factor.

    Is there anything else that you feel is important?

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    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    I have used this model for several years, it has been fairly effective.  I want to see what opinions that others have about this model.  Are there other factors that you know are important?  Each of these factors is rated a % of an overall formula where all the %s add up to 100%.  The rating % goes down as the list number goes up.  In other words WHIP is the most important factor, ERA is the least important factor.

    One thing I want to say first.  The person that taught me how to cap this way did not believe in worrying about the opposing hitters except in the matchup between this game's starting pitcher.  I asked him about that and he said the difference between a .250 hitter and a .300 hitter is .2 hits per game.

    1.  WHIP
    2.  Starter's last outing - this is used as a knockout, if the starter got bombed his last game, don't play him at all.
    3.  HR per innings pitched (over 9 innings)
    4.  K vs BB over 9 innings.  You just do K/BB over 9 innings.
    5.  Atem pitch - an atem pitch is a pitch that gets hit hard, but hit right at someone.  In other words this would have been a double or a triple if it was not hit right at someone  I think the idea here is that this pitcher got very lucky on this pitch.
    6.  Relievers - Relief staff statistics over the last few weeks and against the opposing team. Narrowed down to the relievers who can actually pitch in this game.
    7.  Umpire - Some umpires favor the UNDER, some favor the OVER.  We want umpires that greatly favor the UNDER.  This is a good stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the UNDER, it is a bad stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the OVER.
    8.  Stadium - some stadiums are domes and don't really impact a team.  Other stadiums are open and the weather has a huge impact.  Or, the dimensions to the fence really matter for certain hitters.  Example, player A hits lots of home runs down the first base line in this park with the very short distance to the fence down the first base line, but he does not usually hit home runs down the first base line in more normal parks.
    9.  Weather - is it cold?  Does cold matter in this park?  Is it extremely hot and humid?  Is the wind blowing down the short fence in right field?
    10.  Hitting lineup vs starting pitcher - how does this starter fare vs these hitters.  A few years ago I was betting the Yankees, I forget the pitcher, anyway one of my friends said "that pitcher gets mauled by the hitters in the other team".   The Yankees got killed that game.
    11. IP per start - will the starter go 7 innings?  5 innings?  9 innings?  We want starters who will go 7 innings.  6.3 innings and above is good.  6.0 is okay. Below 6 is bad.
    12. ERA - this is a very small factor.

    Is there anything else that you feel is important?

     
    doubledime
    doubledime
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    Posts: 570
    Posted: May. 6, 2011 - 1:04 PM ET #2

    I take it you look to play totals with these factors, right?

    Another factor I use is the average innings the starter has gone.  In other words, if a starter only averages 5 innings per outing, the releivers becom a bigger factor.  BOL

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    I take it you look to play totals with these factors, right?

    Another factor I use is the average innings the starter has gone.  In other words, if a starter only averages 5 innings per outing, the releivers becom a bigger factor.  BOL

     
    curiousone
    curiousone
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    Posts: 257
    Posted: May. 6, 2011 - 1:29 PM ET #3

    Quote Originally Posted by doubledime:

    I take it you look to play totals with these factors, right?

    Another factor I use is the average innings the starter has gone.  In other words, if a starter only averages 5 innings per outing, the releivers becom a bigger factor.  BOL



    Sides and totals.
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    Quote Originally Posted by doubledime:

    I take it you look to play totals with these factors, right?

    Another factor I use is the average innings the starter has gone.  In other words, if a starter only averages 5 innings per outing, the releivers becom a bigger factor.  BOL



    Sides and totals.
     
    doubledime
    doubledime
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    Posts: 570
    Posted: May. 6, 2011 - 3:00 PM ET #4

    Is the WHIP you use home/away or combined?
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    Is the WHIP you use home/away or combined?
     
    ScreaminPain
    ScreaminPain
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    Posts: 44
    Posted: May. 6, 2011 - 8:41 PM ET #5

    Quote Originally Posted by curiousone:

    1.  WHIP
    2.  Starter's last outing - this is used as a knockout, if the starter got bombed his last game, don't play him at all.
    3.  HR per innings pitched (over 9 innings)
    4.  K vs BB over 9 innings.  You just do K/BB over 9 innings.
    5.  Atem pitch - an atem pitch is a pitch that gets hit hard, but hit right at someone.  In other words this would have been a double or a triple if it was not hit right at someone  I think the idea here is that this pitcher got very lucky on this pitch.
    6.  Relievers - Relief staff statistics over the last few weeks and against the opposing team. Narrowed down to the relievers who can actually pitch in this game.
    7.  Umpire - Some umpires favor the UNDER, some favor the OVER.  We want umpires that greatly favor the UNDER.  This is a good stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the UNDER, it is a bad stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the OVER.
    8.  Stadium - some stadiums are domes and don't really impact a team.  Other stadiums are open and the weather has a huge impact.  Or, the dimensions to the fence really matter for certain hitters.  Example, player A hits lots of home runs down the first base line in this park with the very short distance to the fence down the first base line, but he does not usually hit home runs down the first base line in more normal parks.
    9.  Weather - is it cold?  Does cold matter in this park?  Is it extremely hot and humid?  Is the wind blowing down the short fence in right field?
    10.  Hitting lineup vs starting pitcher - how does this starter fare vs these hitters.  A few years ago I was betting the Yankees, I forget the pitcher, anyway one of my friends said "that pitcher gets mauled by the hitters in the other team".   The Yankees got killed that game.
    11. IP per start - will the starter go 7 innings?  5 innings?  9 innings?  We want starters who will go 7 innings.  6.3 innings and above is good.  6.0 is okay. Below 6 is bad.
    12. ERA - this is a very small factor.

    Is there anything else that you feel is important?

    Ok, I'll throw in my .02 cents worth. 

    1. is important...

    2-3-12. you may want to look into a DIP figure or FIPERA.  These figures relect better on aspects that a pitcher can control vs. ERA.  DIP can be figures this way:((IP*2.35)+(Hits*0.805)+(HR's*10.76)+(BB*2.76)-(K*1.53)/((IP*0.712)+(H*0.244)+(K's*0.096)-(HR's2*0.244)).

    5. ATEM: tough to quantify, reliable data hard to find

    6. Bullypen stats are easy to find and taking the time to differentiate availability can be useful.  This stat is usually about 30% or the teams pitching stats....

    7 Umpires: this can make a big difference in the size of my bets.  I don't base bets upon particular umps, vary the size as to their tendencies.  Notice Barry is 6-0 to the over this year, Danley 5-1 to the under....

    8. Park factors are easily obtained and can be included into 'capping.  Rangers ballpark in Texas has scoring at 1.68 runs above average, while Angles Stadium is .68 below average.  Using these figures will help your over/under totals, but they are somewhat unreliable early on.

    9. I don't use humidity, but I know of a poster across the steet that uses it quite well....

    combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next.

    Good Luck on your action...

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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousone:

    1.  WHIP
    2.  Starter's last outing - this is used as a knockout, if the starter got bombed his last game, don't play him at all.
    3.  HR per innings pitched (over 9 innings)
    4.  K vs BB over 9 innings.  You just do K/BB over 9 innings.
    5.  Atem pitch - an atem pitch is a pitch that gets hit hard, but hit right at someone.  In other words this would have been a double or a triple if it was not hit right at someone  I think the idea here is that this pitcher got very lucky on this pitch.
    6.  Relievers - Relief staff statistics over the last few weeks and against the opposing team. Narrowed down to the relievers who can actually pitch in this game.
    7.  Umpire - Some umpires favor the UNDER, some favor the OVER.  We want umpires that greatly favor the UNDER.  This is a good stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the UNDER, it is a bad stat for us if the umpire greatly favors the OVER.
    8.  Stadium - some stadiums are domes and don't really impact a team.  Other stadiums are open and the weather has a huge impact.  Or, the dimensions to the fence really matter for certain hitters.  Example, player A hits lots of home runs down the first base line in this park with the very short distance to the fence down the first base line, but he does not usually hit home runs down the first base line in more normal parks.
    9.  Weather - is it cold?  Does cold matter in this park?  Is it extremely hot and humid?  Is the wind blowing down the short fence in right field?
    10.  Hitting lineup vs starting pitcher - how does this starter fare vs these hitters.  A few years ago I was betting the Yankees, I forget the pitcher, anyway one of my friends said "that pitcher gets mauled by the hitters in the other team".   The Yankees got killed that game.
    11. IP per start - will the starter go 7 innings?  5 innings?  9 innings?  We want starters who will go 7 innings.  6.3 innings and above is good.  6.0 is okay. Below 6 is bad.
    12. ERA - this is a very small factor.

    Is there anything else that you feel is important?

    Ok, I'll throw in my .02 cents worth. 

    1. is important...

    2-3-12. you may want to look into a DIP figure or FIPERA.  These figures relect better on aspects that a pitcher can control vs. ERA.  DIP can be figures this way:((IP*2.35)+(Hits*0.805)+(HR's*10.76)+(BB*2.76)-(K*1.53)/((IP*0.712)+(H*0.244)+(K's*0.096)-(HR's2*0.244)).

    5. ATEM: tough to quantify, reliable data hard to find

    6. Bullypen stats are easy to find and taking the time to differentiate availability can be useful.  This stat is usually about 30% or the teams pitching stats....

    7 Umpires: this can make a big difference in the size of my bets.  I don't base bets upon particular umps, vary the size as to their tendencies.  Notice Barry is 6-0 to the over this year, Danley 5-1 to the under....

    8. Park factors are easily obtained and can be included into 'capping.  Rangers ballpark in Texas has scoring at 1.68 runs above average, while Angles Stadium is .68 below average.  Using these figures will help your over/under totals, but they are somewhat unreliable early on.

    9. I don't use humidity, but I know of a poster across the steet that uses it quite well....

    combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next.

    Good Luck on your action...

     
    curiousone
    curiousone
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    Joined: Mar, 2009
    Posts: 257
    Posted: May. 7, 2011 - 9:34 AM ET #6

    Quote Originally Posted by doubledime:

    Is the WHIP you use home/away or combined?


    Combined
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    Quote Originally Posted by doubledime:

    Is the WHIP you use home/away or combined?


    Combined
     
    curiousone
    curiousone
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    Joined: Mar, 2009
    Posts: 257
    Posted: May. 7, 2011 - 9:59 AM ET #7

    ScreaminPain,
    "combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next."

    Have you, or anyone you know, created a line from a handicapping model?   If so, how did this line compare with the official lines from somewhere like covers at https://www.covers.com/odds/baseball/mlb-odds.aspx.

    Did you see anything important that I am missing?  It seems like I am missing something but I can't remember what it is.
    Reply
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    ScreaminPain,
    "combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next."

    Have you, or anyone you know, created a line from a handicapping model?   If so, how did this line compare with the official lines from somewhere like covers at https://www.covers.com/odds/baseball/mlb-odds.aspx.

    Did you see anything important that I am missing?  It seems like I am missing something but I can't remember what it is.
     
     
    ScreaminPain
    ScreaminPain
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    Joined: Dec, 2005
    Posts: 44
    Posted: May. 10, 2011 - 12:41 AM ET #8

    Quote Originally Posted by curiousone:

    ScreaminPain,
    "combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next."

    Have you, or anyone you know, created a line from a handicapping model?   If so, how did this line compare with the official lines from somewhere like covers at https://www.covers.com/odds/baseball/mlb-odds.aspx.

    Did you see anything important that I am missing?  It seems like I am missing something but I can't remember what it is.

    I've been away for a couple of days, but I'll respond to the question of creating a line tomorrow......

    Reply
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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousone:

    ScreaminPain,
    "combining all or most of this data will help create a model that does a lot the initial sorting for you......creating a line from the data is next."

    Have you, or anyone you know, created a line from a handicapping model?   If so, how did this line compare with the official lines from somewhere like covers at https://www.covers.com/odds/baseball/mlb-odds.aspx.

    Did you see anything important that I am missing?  It seems like I am missing something but I can't remember what it is.

    I've been away for a couple of days, but I'll respond to the question of creating a line tomorrow......

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    • PART DEUX 226 Covers arrow

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