First off, I had $1,200 on the fight. 1k @ -200 and $200 @ -180. Pacquiao to win. The truth is that Marquez won the fight, but frankly, I am in this for the money. If you want to know why Manny won, here are 3 reasons. 1. He floored Marquez and if it weren't for the bell, the fight would have been over. 2. In the later rounds Marquez ate "fist soup" from Pacquiao and wobbled REAL bad, he somehow gained composure and finished that round and 3. Who do you think the boxing powers are backing? Who the hell are they gonna make more money from? JMM or Pacman? If you apply logic, the answer is Pacquiao. Therefore even though I was swallowing HARD because from a boxing standpoint you COULD say JMM won but........its not only that my friends. I am happily $611.00 richer thanks to this analysis. Always, think about who will make the boxing world more money in the end and you have a winner unless his ass is knocked out! And last but not least, what kind of fool turns down $750,000.00 to fight Pacman to go fight in Indonesia for $30,000.00 and lose, even though it is said he won? That, my friends was the genius of JMM. Good luck on your future bets, mates.
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To remove first post, remove entire topic.
First off, I had $1,200 on the fight. 1k @ -200 and $200 @ -180. Pacquiao to win. The truth is that Marquez won the fight, but frankly, I am in this for the money. If you want to know why Manny won, here are 3 reasons. 1. He floored Marquez and if it weren't for the bell, the fight would have been over. 2. In the later rounds Marquez ate "fist soup" from Pacquiao and wobbled REAL bad, he somehow gained composure and finished that round and 3. Who do you think the boxing powers are backing? Who the hell are they gonna make more money from? JMM or Pacman? If you apply logic, the answer is Pacquiao. Therefore even though I was swallowing HARD because from a boxing standpoint you COULD say JMM won but........its not only that my friends. I am happily $611.00 richer thanks to this analysis. Always, think about who will make the boxing world more money in the end and you have a winner unless his ass is knocked out! And last but not least, what kind of fool turns down $750,000.00 to fight Pacman to go fight in Indonesia for $30,000.00 and lose, even though it is said he won? That, my friends was the genius of JMM. Good luck on your future bets, mates.
First off, I had $1,200 on the fight. 1k @ -200 and $200 @ -180. Pacquiao to win. The truth is that Marquez won the fight, but frankly, I am in this for the money. If you want to know why Manny won, here are 3 reasons. 1. He floored Marquez and if it weren't for the bell, the fight would have been over. 2. In the later rounds Marquez ate "fist soup" from Pacquiao and wobbled REAL bad, he somehow gained composure and finished that round and 3. Who do you think the boxing powers are backing? Who the hell are they gonna make more money from? JMM or Pacman? If you apply logic, the answer is Pacquiao. Therefore even though I was swallowing HARD because from a boxing standpoint you COULD say JMM won but........its not only that my friends. I am happily $611.00 richer thanks to this analysis. Always, think about who will make the boxing world more money in the end and you have a winner unless his ass is knocked out! And last but not least, what kind of fool turns down $750,000.00 to fight Pacman to go fight in Indonesia for $30,000.00 and lose, even though it is said he won? That, my friends was the genius of JMM. Good luck on your future bets, mates.
LOL, you don't think a Marquez win here sets up a lucrative trilogy.
JMM won 11 and 12 so I guess you could say he carried the later rounds, interesting..
Congrats on the win, but you my friend don't really know what you are saying.
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Quote Originally Posted by monkeybuay:
First off, I had $1,200 on the fight. 1k @ -200 and $200 @ -180. Pacquiao to win. The truth is that Marquez won the fight, but frankly, I am in this for the money. If you want to know why Manny won, here are 3 reasons. 1. He floored Marquez and if it weren't for the bell, the fight would have been over. 2. In the later rounds Marquez ate "fist soup" from Pacquiao and wobbled REAL bad, he somehow gained composure and finished that round and 3. Who do you think the boxing powers are backing? Who the hell are they gonna make more money from? JMM or Pacman? If you apply logic, the answer is Pacquiao. Therefore even though I was swallowing HARD because from a boxing standpoint you COULD say JMM won but........its not only that my friends. I am happily $611.00 richer thanks to this analysis. Always, think about who will make the boxing world more money in the end and you have a winner unless his ass is knocked out! And last but not least, what kind of fool turns down $750,000.00 to fight Pacman to go fight in Indonesia for $30,000.00 and lose, even though it is said he won? That, my friends was the genius of JMM. Good luck on your future bets, mates.
LOL, you don't think a Marquez win here sets up a lucrative trilogy.
JMM won 11 and 12 so I guess you could say he carried the later rounds, interesting..
Congrats on the win, but you my friend don't really know what you are saying.
Fuck the both of you! I won due to this analysis and if that is knowing nothing then, thank God, I am not one of you two geniuses...Think idiots, think!
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Fuck the both of you! I won due to this analysis and if that is knowing nothing then, thank God, I am not one of you two geniuses...Think idiots, think!
Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
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Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
Really? You would think there would be more money in a 3rd fight with JMM then a fight against David Diaz, but maybe you are right.
So where are you from? The Philippines?
Yeah and your analysis was basically an uninformed post-fight recap, but okay.
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Quote Originally Posted by monkeybuay:
Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
Really? You would think there would be more money in a 3rd fight with JMM then a fight against David Diaz, but maybe you are right.
So where are you from? The Philippines?
Yeah and your analysis was basically an uninformed post-fight recap, but okay.
Not filipino, not american, citizen of the world. Uninformed winning analysis.......ok, I'll take that any day over, Marquez is a more technical boxer and Marquez is this and Marquez is that. All that counts in my mind is making the money. If you believe it or not, frankly I just don't care. But I will happily post when the next big fight comes up, and provide yet another winner. Me and my uninformed self. Ok, I am bored now with you. See you around the next fight and I WANT the 2 of you to come in my thread and bash me. When the Calzaghe vs. Hopkins fight comes up in April, I will post before the fight to see what you have to say then. Remember, I don't give a flying piece of shit if the boxer is american, filipino, russian, or from any other country for that matter. I care about making money and I really would appreciate it if when that fight comes up, you have USEFUL insight and at the end, we can compare notes, I will post on the 17th of April. Pick and uninformed analysis too! Cheers
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Not filipino, not american, citizen of the world. Uninformed winning analysis.......ok, I'll take that any day over, Marquez is a more technical boxer and Marquez is this and Marquez is that. All that counts in my mind is making the money. If you believe it or not, frankly I just don't care. But I will happily post when the next big fight comes up, and provide yet another winner. Me and my uninformed self. Ok, I am bored now with you. See you around the next fight and I WANT the 2 of you to come in my thread and bash me. When the Calzaghe vs. Hopkins fight comes up in April, I will post before the fight to see what you have to say then. Remember, I don't give a flying piece of shit if the boxer is american, filipino, russian, or from any other country for that matter. I care about making money and I really would appreciate it if when that fight comes up, you have USEFUL insight and at the end, we can compare notes, I will post on the 17th of April. Pick and uninformed analysis too! Cheers
Actually monkey I agree completely with most of what you're saying. Manny was moving up after this fight win or lose. He loses, he blames the weight, declines a rematch saying he can't make the weight, and goes on to make lots of money at 135.
He wins, and he erases the only blemish on his recent pro career. He enhances his stardom, and he goes on to make boatloads more money for himself, Bob Arum, and HBO.
The problem with this theory is that he lost the fight clearly, and many of us knew he would lose this fight beforehand. I agree completely that HBO, Arum, and GBP made a deal beforehand that Pacquiao wins the close rounds, but there weren't many of them. Manny clearly won the 2 rounds in which he hurt Marquez badly, but I had it as a clear victory for JMM. 8-4 is fair and 7-5 was generous to Pacman. For them to perpetuate such a fraud on the people is criminal. But congrats on the win, you either knew of the fix beforehand or you suspected it. Many are probably taking offense to your unfair criticism of Marquez's management team's decision making. Hasn't he paid enough for their ineptitude? All should have been made right for him tonight, but boxing politics and greed will always override truth.
I see it as our obligation as boxing fans to remember this fight as another blemish on Manny Pacquiao's career. I have great respect and admiration for Pac's grit and determination, but he was a beaten man tonight. If you couldn't see the fight, look at their faces. He got his ass kicked worst than Taylor against Winky.
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Actually monkey I agree completely with most of what you're saying. Manny was moving up after this fight win or lose. He loses, he blames the weight, declines a rematch saying he can't make the weight, and goes on to make lots of money at 135.
He wins, and he erases the only blemish on his recent pro career. He enhances his stardom, and he goes on to make boatloads more money for himself, Bob Arum, and HBO.
The problem with this theory is that he lost the fight clearly, and many of us knew he would lose this fight beforehand. I agree completely that HBO, Arum, and GBP made a deal beforehand that Pacquiao wins the close rounds, but there weren't many of them. Manny clearly won the 2 rounds in which he hurt Marquez badly, but I had it as a clear victory for JMM. 8-4 is fair and 7-5 was generous to Pacman. For them to perpetuate such a fraud on the people is criminal. But congrats on the win, you either knew of the fix beforehand or you suspected it. Many are probably taking offense to your unfair criticism of Marquez's management team's decision making. Hasn't he paid enough for their ineptitude? All should have been made right for him tonight, but boxing politics and greed will always override truth.
I see it as our obligation as boxing fans to remember this fight as another blemish on Manny Pacquiao's career. I have great respect and admiration for Pac's grit and determination, but he was a beaten man tonight. If you couldn't see the fight, look at their faces. He got his ass kicked worst than Taylor against Winky.
Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
When asked about a rematch, Manny said "This business is over." He must not want to lose to a guy 3 times.
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Quote Originally Posted by monkeybuay:
Ohh, and Pacquiao is NOT interested in a trilogy, he for one is not in NEED for money as JMM. So there goes your fucking trilogy theory..Americans have always surprised me as not being too bright. G8RB8 and Fullbrights added to the genius list. Hahaha.
When asked about a rematch, Manny said "This business is over." He must not want to lose to a guy 3 times.
LETMESPIN. Thanks for your opinion and writing in my thread. JMM kicked Manny's ass! You are right! I thought I had lost my money until I heard the final decision, but you are right, the fix is in. I know I did not post before the fight or whatever, but I somehow suspected that if he wasn't knocked out, he would "win" the fight on the scorecards! He managed to hurt JMM a couple of times and was hurt a couple of times, but I can say in all honesty, that Pacquiao lost the fight. JMM beat him all through the fight. It is evident, as you also stated that he was going to decline fighting with this guy again. He is really a gifted professional, even being close to 35. As you stated, at the end of the fight you could see that Pacquiao knew in his heart that he was beaten, but as you stated also, he moves up in weight class and makes bucket loads of money for himself and his promoter. Again, thanks for writing on my thread. I like boxing as a whole, been watching since I was a kid with my dad but I have learned a lot about boxing and if I can determine without a doubt where the money should be going, it makes it easier to pick a winner, even though the winner did not win.
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LETMESPIN. Thanks for your opinion and writing in my thread. JMM kicked Manny's ass! You are right! I thought I had lost my money until I heard the final decision, but you are right, the fix is in. I know I did not post before the fight or whatever, but I somehow suspected that if he wasn't knocked out, he would "win" the fight on the scorecards! He managed to hurt JMM a couple of times and was hurt a couple of times, but I can say in all honesty, that Pacquiao lost the fight. JMM beat him all through the fight. It is evident, as you also stated that he was going to decline fighting with this guy again. He is really a gifted professional, even being close to 35. As you stated, at the end of the fight you could see that Pacquiao knew in his heart that he was beaten, but as you stated also, he moves up in weight class and makes bucket loads of money for himself and his promoter. Again, thanks for writing on my thread. I like boxing as a whole, been watching since I was a kid with my dad but I have learned a lot about boxing and if I can determine without a doubt where the money should be going, it makes it easier to pick a winner, even though the winner did not win.
LETMESPIN. Marquez' management hurt him, he could have made good money. It upsets me to think that he lost 750k to go fight in Indonesia for 30k and lose, it is a known fact that if you don't knockout an indonesian boxer you are as good as lost! Your words: "For them to perpetuate such a fraud on the people is criminal. But congrats on the win, you either knew of the fix beforehand or you suspected it". I suspected the fix, didn't know, but it made sense. Allright man, take care, its 3am in my neck of the woods and I'm gonna go catch some shut-eye. Take care.
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LETMESPIN. Marquez' management hurt him, he could have made good money. It upsets me to think that he lost 750k to go fight in Indonesia for 30k and lose, it is a known fact that if you don't knockout an indonesian boxer you are as good as lost! Your words: "For them to perpetuate such a fraud on the people is criminal. But congrats on the win, you either knew of the fix beforehand or you suspected it". I suspected the fix, didn't know, but it made sense. Allright man, take care, its 3am in my neck of the woods and I'm gonna go catch some shut-eye. Take care.
Key rule in boxing betting, when placing a wager on a fight, where it is likely to go to a decision, don't bet against the fighter who will make a bigger money fight if he wins. Example: Felix Sturm vs Oscar De La Hoya, with a huge PPV event signed with Hopkins already, big money was on his side. Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Marquez II didn't have the same implications, as to what we would call "a fixed fight". I've seen many fights ringside and on screen, and watched them over and over just to see if I missed something. Strange decisions have been given out before my eyes live: Livingstone Bramble vs Oba Carr (Carr wins), Lennox Lewis vs Evander Holyfield I (Draw),...the list goes on and on. Congratulations to both fighters on a great fight, and it's a shame that the best fighters in the world aren't getting the paydays they deserve. Instead, boxing has resorted to paying big money to past champions (Roy Jones Jr. vs Felix Trinidad), who perform with lack luster and no determination, contrary to the fighters we saw tonight.
The-Ionizer
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Key rule in boxing betting, when placing a wager on a fight, where it is likely to go to a decision, don't bet against the fighter who will make a bigger money fight if he wins. Example: Felix Sturm vs Oscar De La Hoya, with a huge PPV event signed with Hopkins already, big money was on his side. Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Marquez II didn't have the same implications, as to what we would call "a fixed fight". I've seen many fights ringside and on screen, and watched them over and over just to see if I missed something. Strange decisions have been given out before my eyes live: Livingstone Bramble vs Oba Carr (Carr wins), Lennox Lewis vs Evander Holyfield I (Draw),...the list goes on and on. Congratulations to both fighters on a great fight, and it's a shame that the best fighters in the world aren't getting the paydays they deserve. Instead, boxing has resorted to paying big money to past champions (Roy Jones Jr. vs Felix Trinidad), who perform with lack luster and no determination, contrary to the fighters we saw tonight.
people who think marquez clearly won, can you post what rounds you think he won? I thought marquez won the fight 114-113. I had for manny rounds (1 (could of gone either way in my point), 3 with the knockdown, 9,10,and 11. But I sort of knew they would give it to manny because he is a star fighter, and has many years ahead marquez (who is 5 years older than manny).
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people who think marquez clearly won, can you post what rounds you think he won? I thought marquez won the fight 114-113. I had for manny rounds (1 (could of gone either way in my point), 3 with the knockdown, 9,10,and 11. But I sort of knew they would give it to manny because he is a star fighter, and has many years ahead marquez (who is 5 years older than manny).
Just watched the Setanta broadcast again. Too sickened to watch Lampley and clowns on HBO. In my view, Marquez won clearly rounds 1,2,5,6,7,8,11,12. On the judges cards 1 and 6 went to Pacquiao on 5/6 cards. I would like to know how those 2 could possibly go to Pacman. Manny got nothing done in either round. In round 6 especially, Marquez punished Pacquiao with right hands and upper cuts. For Miller and Ford to score 6 for Pacquiao, I mean you just have to wonder. Freddie Roach told Manny he was losing the fight after that round.
Pacman won 3,4, and 10 convincingly. 9 and 7 were close, and I would give Manny a slight edge in 9. However you have those two, there's no way Pacman won more than 5 rounds. Wally Matthews (who had Marquez winning by a point) stated many times that this was not a difficult fight to score. Each man won his rounds very convincingly, Marquez just won more of them. In the championship rounds, Manny Pacquio had nothing left, when the fight should have been on the table. In reality, Arum had already taken care of him, and Manny only had to stay on his feet to win.
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kevk-
Just watched the Setanta broadcast again. Too sickened to watch Lampley and clowns on HBO. In my view, Marquez won clearly rounds 1,2,5,6,7,8,11,12. On the judges cards 1 and 6 went to Pacquiao on 5/6 cards. I would like to know how those 2 could possibly go to Pacman. Manny got nothing done in either round. In round 6 especially, Marquez punished Pacquiao with right hands and upper cuts. For Miller and Ford to score 6 for Pacquiao, I mean you just have to wonder. Freddie Roach told Manny he was losing the fight after that round.
Pacman won 3,4, and 10 convincingly. 9 and 7 were close, and I would give Manny a slight edge in 9. However you have those two, there's no way Pacman won more than 5 rounds. Wally Matthews (who had Marquez winning by a point) stated many times that this was not a difficult fight to score. Each man won his rounds very convincingly, Marquez just won more of them. In the championship rounds, Manny Pacquio had nothing left, when the fight should have been on the table. In reality, Arum had already taken care of him, and Manny only had to stay on his feet to win.
You are right LetMeSpin, all Pacquiao needed to do was stay on his feet, because he DID NOT win more rounds than JMM, but as kevk stated, " I sort of knew they would give it to Manny because he is a star fighter, and has many years ahead Marquez". But it shouldn't be that way
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You are right LetMeSpin, all Pacquiao needed to do was stay on his feet, because he DID NOT win more rounds than JMM, but as kevk stated, " I sort of knew they would give it to Manny because he is a star fighter, and has many years ahead Marquez". But it shouldn't be that way
Rafael's remark: After the tremendous action fight they waged in
their disputed 2004 draw, nobody should be at all surprised that when
Pacquiao and Marquez finally met in a rematch, they produced another
enthralling, bloody and dramatic fight for the ages. We'll certainly be
talking about it at the end of the year when it comes time to pick the
fight of the year.
It could have gone either way -- they are so perfectly matched
that virtually every round was close other than the third round, in
which Pacquiao nailed Marquez with a left hand and knocked him down.
The 12th round was also a big Marquez round.
The disturbing thing was to hear the crybaby Marquez camp whining and
complaining endlessly about the decision as though it was scandalous.
They should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. It's one thing to
proclaim victory and express disappointment in a close decision loss.
It's another to imply that some kind of shadowy element had it in for
you and that the judging was somehow not on the up and up. The Marquez
camp was almost as bad a few weeks ago when Rafael Marquez, Juan's
brother, lost a tough decision in his rubber match with Israel Vazquez.
There are fights in which certain scores are mind-blowing and
you really have to question the competency of the judges. This was not
one of them. It was merely a razor-close fight that was awesome to
watch because it had many close rounds. Marquez really has only himself
to blame for the defeat. If he didn't get knocked down, the fight would
have been a draw and he would have kept his title. Sure, many ringside
media had it for Marquez, but only by a point or two, and even those
who had him winning didn't complain about the official decision.
Marquez would like an immediate third fight, and it's hard to
blame him. Pacquiao isn't interested in that, however, and promoter Bob
Arum made their position clear: Take a break from each other, let them
fight interim bouts so that a third fight will be even bigger and worth
even more money. It makes sense and it is hard to argue Arum's logic.
I think this viewpoint makes more sense than anything you guys are espousing.
Rafael's remark: After the tremendous action fight they waged in
their disputed 2004 draw, nobody should be at all surprised that when
Pacquiao and Marquez finally met in a rematch, they produced another
enthralling, bloody and dramatic fight for the ages. We'll certainly be
talking about it at the end of the year when it comes time to pick the
fight of the year.
It could have gone either way -- they are so perfectly matched
that virtually every round was close other than the third round, in
which Pacquiao nailed Marquez with a left hand and knocked him down.
The 12th round was also a big Marquez round.
The disturbing thing was to hear the crybaby Marquez camp whining and
complaining endlessly about the decision as though it was scandalous.
They should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. It's one thing to
proclaim victory and express disappointment in a close decision loss.
It's another to imply that some kind of shadowy element had it in for
you and that the judging was somehow not on the up and up. The Marquez
camp was almost as bad a few weeks ago when Rafael Marquez, Juan's
brother, lost a tough decision in his rubber match with Israel Vazquez.
There are fights in which certain scores are mind-blowing and
you really have to question the competency of the judges. This was not
one of them. It was merely a razor-close fight that was awesome to
watch because it had many close rounds. Marquez really has only himself
to blame for the defeat. If he didn't get knocked down, the fight would
have been a draw and he would have kept his title. Sure, many ringside
media had it for Marquez, but only by a point or two, and even those
who had him winning didn't complain about the official decision.
Marquez would like an immediate third fight, and it's hard to
blame him. Pacquiao isn't interested in that, however, and promoter Bob
Arum made their position clear: Take a break from each other, let them
fight interim bouts so that a third fight will be even bigger and worth
even more money. It makes sense and it is hard to argue Arum's logic.
I think this viewpoint makes more sense than anything you guys are espousing.
Esplanade...Your reasoning is logical, there's a chance you could be right.
That's actually Dan Rafael's reasoning. Ironically, he scored the fight 114-113 Marquez. It was a close fight, plain and simple. Do I think Marquez won? Yes.
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Quote Originally Posted by monkeybuay:
Esplanade...Your reasoning is logical, there's a chance you could be right.
That's actually Dan Rafael's reasoning. Ironically, he scored the fight 114-113 Marquez. It was a close fight, plain and simple. Do I think Marquez won? Yes.
Monkeybuay and theionizer: What is hilarious is that you act as if the fight with the most earning potential always gets the nod in a close fight that goes to the cards. You cite examples one way and don't cite any the other. I see I Ionizer that you dug as far into the closet as Bramble-Carr. How about Baldomir-Judah in Judah's backyard or Raheem-Morales in that last couple of years before major PPV's. It's a factor in betting, but it shouldn't by any means be used as the strongest indicator for making a play.
Monkeybuay it sounds like this is what you base your plays off of. I guess it was tough swallowing all that chalk on Paul Williams then, you didn't have any worries before the decision was announced right.
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Monkeybuay and theionizer: What is hilarious is that you act as if the fight with the most earning potential always gets the nod in a close fight that goes to the cards. You cite examples one way and don't cite any the other. I see I Ionizer that you dug as far into the closet as Bramble-Carr. How about Baldomir-Judah in Judah's backyard or Raheem-Morales in that last couple of years before major PPV's. It's a factor in betting, but it shouldn't by any means be used as the strongest indicator for making a play.
Monkeybuay it sounds like this is what you base your plays off of. I guess it was tough swallowing all that chalk on Paul Williams then, you didn't have any worries before the decision was announced right.
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