Do you have any information on how this system plays out regarding KenPom's point difference vs. the spread?
For example in the 3 games we have for today KenPom predicts the final results:
Furman loses 76-64 (difference of 12 points vs. spread of 13) Southern Utah loses 70-56 (difference of 14 points vs. spread of 10.5) Fairfield loses 67-59 (difference of 8 points vs. spread of 8)
As you can see the Furman and Fairfield spreads are right around the KenPom numbers. However, the Southern Utah game is 3.5 points from where we might expect it to be. On the surface it appears that Southern Utah might not be as strong of a play as the other two. However, the way I've been playing these differences, even in other games that don't fit the system, is to make a larger play on the team who is giving up those few extra points. It's a counterintuitive play. Perhaps I'm wrong with this and would like to know how you guys feel about it. Here's what I mean.
So for example, let's take the Southern Utah game. Predicted 70-56. 14 point difference. I would make a larger play on this game if the point spread is 10.5 like it is as opposed to say 17.5. Some of you are probably thinking Imprezive's an idiot. Why would he value getting just 10.5 MORE than getting 17.5 points? And my reasoning is Vegas knows something or has somehow factored in SOMETHING to make the spread at 10.5 as opposed to the 14 that it should be or the 17.5 that it could be.
I've noticed that if you compare the KenPom game predictions to the actual spreads that that the good majority are almost spot on. Furman and Fairfield are great examples of that. And the good majority of games are like that too. KenPom usually comes very close to the spread. So what would posses Vegas to set a line 3 points one way or the other? This is what I don't understand. Not just why they do it, but also what is the correct play? And I'd like to hear your thoughts.
I'll leave you with one more example from today's games that fits what I'm talking about. It is NOT a system play, but just want to throw it out there to see who you would pick and why you think the line is the way it is. Miami @ Florida State -5. Ken Pom predicts a score of 62-54. That's predicting an 8 point FSU win, but yet the line is at 5. Here's where you can feel free to bash me for being an idiot or saying yeah that's spot on. In this example if I had to bet, I'd take Miami +5. And my angle is there has got to be some sort of mathematical reason or whatever that Vegas didn't set the line around 8. They're not in the business of giving away money. And you can't say it's about the big name of Miami or any of that because this example doesn't seem any different than the Southern Utah game today. And that one is particularly intriguing.
So Las Vegas, you mean to tell me that about the worst team in all of Division 1 ball according to Ken Pom, Southern Utah, is going to get just 10.5 points as opposed to the 14 they should be getting!?!? Does this not scream for suckers to bet Sacramento State? Does this not mean that us, the savvy betters (term loosely as I've been sucking hard), should bet on Southern Utah because we know Vegas doesn't just hand out these gifts?
What is your angle on this guys? Am I over thinking this or am I onto something? CJM says he likes Furman the best today and I'll be on them and the other 2 because of this system. But to me, I like Southern Utah the best.
Thanks for your help guys and thank you for sharing this system with us.
imprezive,
well thought out analysis and work by you.any angle we can try and get helps. I will only speak for myself....I trust the system as it has made me money(and 'pre' system) last 3 years so I don't get into all the work that you are doing trying to figure out why vegas would set a line a couple points different than kenpom rankings and estimates. I would drive myself whacky trying to figure out what makes the linesmakers tick and set numbers for whatever reason and there are plenty of intangables from which they can do this. again, if we could know why they would set a number we need to take our talents elsewhere.i continue to believe that vegas sets lines to get + money, doesn't always work that way, as we know money can move lines, as well as a number of other things. so without further comment..as a recovering alcoholic I try to keep it simple and just wager system and don't 'confuse' myself. again, we are garden variety bettors and everyone is different. just giving my two cents here! gl tonight! ryno
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Quote Originally Posted by Imprezive97:
Do you have any information on how this system plays out regarding KenPom's point difference vs. the spread?
For example in the 3 games we have for today KenPom predicts the final results:
Furman loses 76-64 (difference of 12 points vs. spread of 13) Southern Utah loses 70-56 (difference of 14 points vs. spread of 10.5) Fairfield loses 67-59 (difference of 8 points vs. spread of 8)
As you can see the Furman and Fairfield spreads are right around the KenPom numbers. However, the Southern Utah game is 3.5 points from where we might expect it to be. On the surface it appears that Southern Utah might not be as strong of a play as the other two. However, the way I've been playing these differences, even in other games that don't fit the system, is to make a larger play on the team who is giving up those few extra points. It's a counterintuitive play. Perhaps I'm wrong with this and would like to know how you guys feel about it. Here's what I mean.
So for example, let's take the Southern Utah game. Predicted 70-56. 14 point difference. I would make a larger play on this game if the point spread is 10.5 like it is as opposed to say 17.5. Some of you are probably thinking Imprezive's an idiot. Why would he value getting just 10.5 MORE than getting 17.5 points? And my reasoning is Vegas knows something or has somehow factored in SOMETHING to make the spread at 10.5 as opposed to the 14 that it should be or the 17.5 that it could be.
I've noticed that if you compare the KenPom game predictions to the actual spreads that that the good majority are almost spot on. Furman and Fairfield are great examples of that. And the good majority of games are like that too. KenPom usually comes very close to the spread. So what would posses Vegas to set a line 3 points one way or the other? This is what I don't understand. Not just why they do it, but also what is the correct play? And I'd like to hear your thoughts.
I'll leave you with one more example from today's games that fits what I'm talking about. It is NOT a system play, but just want to throw it out there to see who you would pick and why you think the line is the way it is. Miami @ Florida State -5. Ken Pom predicts a score of 62-54. That's predicting an 8 point FSU win, but yet the line is at 5. Here's where you can feel free to bash me for being an idiot or saying yeah that's spot on. In this example if I had to bet, I'd take Miami +5. And my angle is there has got to be some sort of mathematical reason or whatever that Vegas didn't set the line around 8. They're not in the business of giving away money. And you can't say it's about the big name of Miami or any of that because this example doesn't seem any different than the Southern Utah game today. And that one is particularly intriguing.
So Las Vegas, you mean to tell me that about the worst team in all of Division 1 ball according to Ken Pom, Southern Utah, is going to get just 10.5 points as opposed to the 14 they should be getting!?!? Does this not scream for suckers to bet Sacramento State? Does this not mean that us, the savvy betters (term loosely as I've been sucking hard), should bet on Southern Utah because we know Vegas doesn't just hand out these gifts?
What is your angle on this guys? Am I over thinking this or am I onto something? CJM says he likes Furman the best today and I'll be on them and the other 2 because of this system. But to me, I like Southern Utah the best.
Thanks for your help guys and thank you for sharing this system with us.
imprezive,
well thought out analysis and work by you.any angle we can try and get helps. I will only speak for myself....I trust the system as it has made me money(and 'pre' system) last 3 years so I don't get into all the work that you are doing trying to figure out why vegas would set a line a couple points different than kenpom rankings and estimates. I would drive myself whacky trying to figure out what makes the linesmakers tick and set numbers for whatever reason and there are plenty of intangables from which they can do this. again, if we could know why they would set a number we need to take our talents elsewhere.i continue to believe that vegas sets lines to get + money, doesn't always work that way, as we know money can move lines, as well as a number of other things. so without further comment..as a recovering alcoholic I try to keep it simple and just wager system and don't 'confuse' myself. again, we are garden variety bettors and everyone is different. just giving my two cents here! gl tonight! ryno
case in point- Fairfield, + 8 opener, I grabbed it at opener.....line moves to +7.... why? could it be money or....who knows...but im glad I got it early. further....is it now a system play? Kine says yes! im with him on this......and ill take Fairfield and try to win more than I lose tonight..gl ryno
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case in point- Fairfield, + 8 opener, I grabbed it at opener.....line moves to +7.... why? could it be money or....who knows...but im glad I got it early. further....is it now a system play? Kine says yes! im with him on this......and ill take Fairfield and try to win more than I lose tonight..gl ryno
divot...I was playing them but after Saturday I might just go light on just the ones I like.......was far as money lines….then system starts Thursday ill throw 25 to 50 on ml if they are true system fit.
gl today! ryno
Respect your skills. However Kine said once you are playing ML you are "no longer playing system". Have you tweaked system to benefit your leans?
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Quote Originally Posted by ryno23:
divot...I was playing them but after Saturday I might just go light on just the ones I like.......was far as money lines….then system starts Thursday ill throw 25 to 50 on ml if they are true system fit.
gl today! ryno
Respect your skills. However Kine said once you are playing ML you are "no longer playing system". Have you tweaked system to benefit your leans?
Imprezive, I tried a system based on what you're saying and found that at the beginning of the season, it was profitable Then as the season progressed, it became more 50/50. One thing I found odd was that following that system on Saturdays got me killed. I finally gave up on it and haven't tracked it since but I doubt it would be profitable longterm. Just my two cents.
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Imprezive, I tried a system based on what you're saying and found that at the beginning of the season, it was profitable Then as the season progressed, it became more 50/50. One thing I found odd was that following that system on Saturdays got me killed. I finally gave up on it and haven't tracked it since but I doubt it would be profitable longterm. Just my two cents.
Respect your skills. However Kine said once you are playing ML you are "no longer playing system". Have you tweaked system to benefit your leans?
it is just a personal thing I like to do thom, I don't even know the win percentage for ml dogs in system that win....I don't wager much on it.just like to have a sprinkle on them just in case....all good....no tweeks or adjustments...just playin the system! gl tonight! ryno
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Quote Originally Posted by thomthekid:
Respect your skills. However Kine said once you are playing ML you are "no longer playing system". Have you tweaked system to benefit your leans?
it is just a personal thing I like to do thom, I don't even know the win percentage for ml dogs in system that win....I don't wager much on it.just like to have a sprinkle on them just in case....all good....no tweeks or adjustments...just playin the system! gl tonight! ryno
Imprezive, I tried a system based on what you're saying and found that at the beginning of the season, it was profitable Then as the season progressed, it became more 50/50. One thing I found odd was that following that system on Saturdays got me killed. I finally gave up on it and haven't tracked it since but I doubt it would be profitable longterm. Just my two cents.
Probably because Saturdays are one of the few times fans will show up to support crappy teams at home.
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Quote Originally Posted by gfdog:
Imprezive, I tried a system based on what you're saying and found that at the beginning of the season, it was profitable Then as the season progressed, it became more 50/50. One thing I found odd was that following that system on Saturdays got me killed. I finally gave up on it and haven't tracked it since but I doubt it would be profitable longterm. Just my two cents.
Probably because Saturdays are one of the few times fans will show up to support crappy teams at home.
it is just a personal thing I like to do thom, I don't even know the win percentage for ml dogs in system that win....I don't wager much on it.just like to have a sprinkle on them just in case....all good....no tweeks or adjustments...just playin the system! gl tonight! ryno
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Quote Originally Posted by ryno23:
it is just a personal thing I like to do thom, I don't even know the win percentage for ml dogs in system that win....I don't wager much on it.just like to have a sprinkle on them just in case....all good....no tweeks or adjustments...just playin the system! gl tonight! ryno
well thought out analysis and work by you.any angle we can try and get helps. I will only speak for myself....I trust the system as it has made me money(and 'pre' system) last 3 years so I don't get into all the work that you are doing trying to figure out why vegas would set a line a couple points different than kenpom rankings and estimates. I would drive myself whacky trying to figure out what makes the linesmakers tick and set numbers for whatever reason and there are plenty of intangables from which they can do this. again, if we could know why they would set a number we need to take our talents elsewhere.i continue to believe that vegas sets lines to get + money, doesn't always work that way, as we know money can move lines, as well as a number of other things. so without further comment..as a recovering alcoholic I try to keep it simple and just wager system and don't 'confuse' myself. again, we are garden variety bettors and everyone is different. just giving my two cents here! gl tonight! ryno
I noticed a system based on this a while back but I think it was on teams in general. It may be worth it to track teams that are in the same pool as this system.
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Quote Originally Posted by ryno23:
imprezive,
well thought out analysis and work by you.any angle we can try and get helps. I will only speak for myself....I trust the system as it has made me money(and 'pre' system) last 3 years so I don't get into all the work that you are doing trying to figure out why vegas would set a line a couple points different than kenpom rankings and estimates. I would drive myself whacky trying to figure out what makes the linesmakers tick and set numbers for whatever reason and there are plenty of intangables from which they can do this. again, if we could know why they would set a number we need to take our talents elsewhere.i continue to believe that vegas sets lines to get + money, doesn't always work that way, as we know money can move lines, as well as a number of other things. so without further comment..as a recovering alcoholic I try to keep it simple and just wager system and don't 'confuse' myself. again, we are garden variety bettors and everyone is different. just giving my two cents here! gl tonight! ryno
I noticed a system based on this a while back but I think it was on teams in general. It may be worth it to track teams that are in the same pool as this system.
I might have to let this thread bet all my system plays way down and then go back huge the other way! Best of luck to you all - more importantly than the system is understanding the flaws in how lines are made and how to exploit them - also works well with betting mma as well as a few other sports as well
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I might have to let this thread bet all my system plays way down and then go back huge the other way! Best of luck to you all - more importantly than the system is understanding the flaws in how lines are made and how to exploit them - also works well with betting mma as well as a few other sports as well
Congrats ryno on halves and games. Thanks for posting this system. For me games are enough. Good luck to you on halves and ML. From Saturday plays and todays plays am ahead. Will keep following. Bets of luck....
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Congrats ryno on halves and games. Thanks for posting this system. For me games are enough. Good luck to you on halves and ML. From Saturday plays and todays plays am ahead. Will keep following. Bets of luck....
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