Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson: Quote Originally Posted by ABooksNightmare: Why would any reasonable American think that anyone other than US citizens should be allowed to vote...
In every state non-citizens are already ineligible to vote in federal elections under U.S. law. No evidence supports claims of widespread voting fraud. House republicans election bill is a solution for non-existing problem.
I mean seriously, how freakn stupid is it for GOP Keystone Cops to draft a new law that says something which is already ILLEGAL, should now be declared again to be.....umm......er..... ILLEGAL!
1
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:
Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson: Quote Originally Posted by ABooksNightmare: Why would any reasonable American think that anyone other than US citizens should be allowed to vote...
In every state non-citizens are already ineligible to vote in federal elections under U.S. law. No evidence supports claims of widespread voting fraud. House republicans election bill is a solution for non-existing problem.
I mean seriously, how freakn stupid is it for GOP Keystone Cops to draft a new law that says something which is already ILLEGAL, should now be declared again to be.....umm......er..... ILLEGAL!
Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*.
Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*.
the voter eligibility is not the issue, the issue is some states are not IDing the voters. Chain of custody, validate signatures. It's not the law that's being disputed it is the integrity of the votes
I am not disputing an election, but there was a mass of fraud with the mail in and ballot box shit. Even if it doesn't come close to a vote count, it's the fact that it is this easy to manipulate a vote for a federal election is the reason it is still talked about. I have had personal conversations with Trump haters who openly admitted that they voted early and voted at the box on 11/11
1
the voter eligibility is not the issue, the issue is some states are not IDing the voters. Chain of custody, validate signatures. It's not the law that's being disputed it is the integrity of the votes
I am not disputing an election, but there was a mass of fraud with the mail in and ballot box shit. Even if it doesn't come close to a vote count, it's the fact that it is this easy to manipulate a vote for a federal election is the reason it is still talked about. I have had personal conversations with Trump haters who openly admitted that they voted early and voted at the box on 11/11
Quote Originally Posted by Europa: @fubah2 Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*. *https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-hold-first-campaign-rally-after-assassination-attempt-2024-07-20/ @Europa WOW. That's low even for the CONVICTED FELON!
understatement
"I'm the MOST HONEST HUMAN BEING that God has EVER created!!" - Donald Trump
1
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:
Quote Originally Posted by Europa: @fubah2 Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*. *https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-hold-first-campaign-rally-after-assassination-attempt-2024-07-20/ @Europa WOW. That's low even for the CONVICTED FELON!
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by Europa: @fubah2 Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*. *https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-hold-first-campaign-rally-after-assassination-attempt-2024-07-20/ @Europa WOW. That's low even for the CONVICTED FELON! understatement
I'll say!!
0
Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964:
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by Europa: @fubah2 Trump goes back to his usual personal attack after calling for national unity little while ago, now he compares to former US House Speaker as a "dog"*. *https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-hold-first-campaign-rally-after-assassination-attempt-2024-07-20/ @Europa WOW. That's low even for the CONVICTED FELON! understatement
@fubah2 Vice president Kamala Harris may not beat Trump in November, but the way I see from Dems' presidential nominee it will be Harris if not Biden. Sure, I could be wrong again. I will say, we should not underestimate the wrath of woman voters who got ripped away their heath care and freedom of choices by GOP. I'll never wish ill luck to your bets on the election, dogs has won the last couple of presidential elections. Ukraine, NATO, women, girls, democracy, Supreme Court, .... so much essentials are in stake on November.
@Europa
Yep, a good argument can be made for that and Harris might have a slightly stronger appeal to women voters.
2
Quote Originally Posted by Europa:
@fubah2 Vice president Kamala Harris may not beat Trump in November, but the way I see from Dems' presidential nominee it will be Harris if not Biden. Sure, I could be wrong again. I will say, we should not underestimate the wrath of woman voters who got ripped away their heath care and freedom of choices by GOP. I'll never wish ill luck to your bets on the election, dogs has won the last couple of presidential elections. Ukraine, NATO, women, girls, democracy, Supreme Court, .... so much essentials are in stake on November.
@Europa
Yep, a good argument can be made for that and Harris might have a slightly stronger appeal to women voters.
the issue is some states are not IDing the voters. Chain of custody, validate signatures. It's not the law that's being disputed it is the integrity of the votes I am not disputing an election, but there was a mass of fraud with the mail in and ballot box shit. Even if it doesn't come close to a vote count, it's the fact that it is this easy to manipulate a vote for a federal election is the reason it is still talked about.
Not wrong for states to use different ways to verify voter identity because millions of eligible voters lack government photo IDs.. Signature matching, utility bills, bank statements and government documents. Since right to vote is fundamental for adult US citizens, more important to allow eligible voters to vote instead of preventing virtually non-existing fraud. For years, republicans have exaggerated the extent of voting fraud in the US. Heritage foundation found only 1 suspected case per 2 million votes in 20 years of elections. All major investigations found no evidence of widespread fraud for mail and absent voting.
1
Quote Originally Posted by soup-can:
the issue is some states are not IDing the voters. Chain of custody, validate signatures. It's not the law that's being disputed it is the integrity of the votes I am not disputing an election, but there was a mass of fraud with the mail in and ballot box shit. Even if it doesn't come close to a vote count, it's the fact that it is this easy to manipulate a vote for a federal election is the reason it is still talked about.
Not wrong for states to use different ways to verify voter identity because millions of eligible voters lack government photo IDs.. Signature matching, utility bills, bank statements and government documents. Since right to vote is fundamental for adult US citizens, more important to allow eligible voters to vote instead of preventing virtually non-existing fraud. For years, republicans have exaggerated the extent of voting fraud in the US. Heritage foundation found only 1 suspected case per 2 million votes in 20 years of elections. All major investigations found no evidence of widespread fraud for mail and absent voting.
If you lack an ID, isn't that the citizens problem not the government? In most states, you are required to show proof of identity in various situations....if you want to vote, go get an ID...it's not that hard...you have 4 years in between elections to do so
It's not about exaggerating the extent of voting fraud, it is about getting it right and eliminating any chance that there are people voting that should not be voting...that's called fairness and making sure a vote that counts should be accounted for and those that should not count should be ignored...let me know next time you are allowed to vote in Mexico's election or Canada's election and then you can talk...
Even if there is 1 vote that counted it shows there is a flaw...with as much fraud as there is in America are people that naive to think that if there couldn't be fraud in elections...surely you jest...prove who you are and your vote counts...pretty simple...not sure how or why it got off track from doing the right thing...if you are not trying to do something shady and you want your vote to count, then prove who you are...this is common sense...
a lot of you mention widespread fraud, but why does it have to widespread? Isn't just one vote proof that the system lacks responsibility and integrity? In a world where the US is to be ahead of the times and tech savvy, how could you, or anyone with a straight face, claim that there should not be e better system in place if we have the means to do so...
Prove who you are if you want your vote to count....pretty simple and not a delusional concept really...I'm a US citizen and I more than happy to prove who I am with no problems...what about you?
COVERS allows u to tell someone they are sexually frustrated so long as ur hands are clean
0
If you lack an ID, isn't that the citizens problem not the government? In most states, you are required to show proof of identity in various situations....if you want to vote, go get an ID...it's not that hard...you have 4 years in between elections to do so
It's not about exaggerating the extent of voting fraud, it is about getting it right and eliminating any chance that there are people voting that should not be voting...that's called fairness and making sure a vote that counts should be accounted for and those that should not count should be ignored...let me know next time you are allowed to vote in Mexico's election or Canada's election and then you can talk...
Even if there is 1 vote that counted it shows there is a flaw...with as much fraud as there is in America are people that naive to think that if there couldn't be fraud in elections...surely you jest...prove who you are and your vote counts...pretty simple...not sure how or why it got off track from doing the right thing...if you are not trying to do something shady and you want your vote to count, then prove who you are...this is common sense...
a lot of you mention widespread fraud, but why does it have to widespread? Isn't just one vote proof that the system lacks responsibility and integrity? In a world where the US is to be ahead of the times and tech savvy, how could you, or anyone with a straight face, claim that there should not be e better system in place if we have the means to do so...
Prove who you are if you want your vote to count....pretty simple and not a delusional concept really...I'm a US citizen and I more than happy to prove who I am with no problems...what about you?
Not wrong for states to use different ways to verify voter identity because millions of eligible voters lack government photo IDs.. Signature matching, utility bills, bank statements and government documents. Since right to vote is fundamental for adult US citizens, more important to allow eligible voters to vote instead of preventing virtually non-existing fraud. For years, republicans have exaggerated the extent of voting fraud in the US. Heritage foundation found only 1 suspected case per 2 million votes in 20 years of elections. All major investigations found no evidence of widespread fraud for mail and absent voting.
Most of the real verifiable election fraud from 2020 was by republicans, and that is a fact.
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Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:
Not wrong for states to use different ways to verify voter identity because millions of eligible voters lack government photo IDs.. Signature matching, utility bills, bank statements and government documents. Since right to vote is fundamental for adult US citizens, more important to allow eligible voters to vote instead of preventing virtually non-existing fraud. For years, republicans have exaggerated the extent of voting fraud in the US. Heritage foundation found only 1 suspected case per 2 million votes in 20 years of elections. All major investigations found no evidence of widespread fraud for mail and absent voting.
Most of the real verifiable election fraud from 2020 was by republicans, and that is a fact.
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
2
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
I don't disagree with providing ID's to individuals by the government...this is why there has been talk about having a national card issued to citizens, but it's not wanted apparently because we don't have one...
However, if there is no problem with voting fraud or voter identity, as you state, then there should be no problem in providing proof that you are you say you are to vote..hasn't that been the complaint by many as it relates to the whole proof of identity issues?...voting is a right, but it can also be taken away just as any other rights one may have here in the US...you have a right for your vote to be taken away from you if you are unable to prove who you are...pretty simple...a lot of people have been complaining about the whole show proof to vote issue, yet it's been 4 years since last election and you can't still be talking about it if you have had that many days to fix your problem and have not...does one choose to spend $10 or $20 to obtain an ID so they can vote or do they want to spend that on a pack of cigarettes? Life is about choices and if it is important to you to vote then you will get your affairs in order to do so and if it is not that important to you to vote then you will buy those cigarettes....
I don't see then need to keep mentioning how showing proof of ID is voter suppression when it is indeed not...if you haven't been able to figure out how to get an ID in 4 years time then whose fault is that? If you want national ID cards to be issued by the government to everyone, then let's talk about that but to say voters are being suppressed is just a lil far fetched...Choices!
COVERS allows u to tell someone they are sexually frustrated so long as ur hands are clean
0
Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
I don't disagree with providing ID's to individuals by the government...this is why there has been talk about having a national card issued to citizens, but it's not wanted apparently because we don't have one...
However, if there is no problem with voting fraud or voter identity, as you state, then there should be no problem in providing proof that you are you say you are to vote..hasn't that been the complaint by many as it relates to the whole proof of identity issues?...voting is a right, but it can also be taken away just as any other rights one may have here in the US...you have a right for your vote to be taken away from you if you are unable to prove who you are...pretty simple...a lot of people have been complaining about the whole show proof to vote issue, yet it's been 4 years since last election and you can't still be talking about it if you have had that many days to fix your problem and have not...does one choose to spend $10 or $20 to obtain an ID so they can vote or do they want to spend that on a pack of cigarettes? Life is about choices and if it is important to you to vote then you will get your affairs in order to do so and if it is not that important to you to vote then you will buy those cigarettes....
I don't see then need to keep mentioning how showing proof of ID is voter suppression when it is indeed not...if you haven't been able to figure out how to get an ID in 4 years time then whose fault is that? If you want national ID cards to be issued by the government to everyone, then let's talk about that but to say voters are being suppressed is just a lil far fetched...Choices!
Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem.
There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective.
You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process.
Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
2
@ABooksNightmare
Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem.
There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective.
You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process.
Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
dems do gerrymander too but not as much as republicans
all the rest is owned by donnie chump fascist party alone
"I'm the MOST HONEST HUMAN BEING that God has EVER created!!" - Donald Trump
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Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:
States should help provide photo I.D. because voting is supposed to be a fundamental right for eligible voters instead of a priviledge such as poll tax. Sricter voter identity laws won't fix the main threats to democracy. Misinformation promoting elections as rigged. Voting suppression that restricts eligible voters. Minority rule. Extreme gerrymandering. Election coup. Irresponsible party that doesn't respect democracy.
dems do gerrymander too but not as much as republicans
all the rest is owned by donnie chump fascist party alone
We finally know what caused the global tech outage
- and how much it cost
CNN —
Insurers have begun calculating the financial damage caused by last week’s devastating CrowdStrike software glitch that crashed computers, canceled flights and disrupted hospitals all around the globe — and the picture isn’t pretty.
What’s been described as the largest IT outage in history will cost Fortune 500 companies alone more than $5 billion in direct losses, according to one insurer’s analysis of the incident published Wednesday.
Numerous Fortune 500 companies use CrowdStrike’s cybersecurity software to detect and block hacking threats. But when CrowdStrike issued an update last week to its signature cybersecurity software, known as Falcon, millions of computers around the world running Microsoft Windows crashed because of the way that the update interacted with Windows.
Clearly this must be blamed on evil Joe Biden!!
2
"It's all Joe Biden's fault!"
We finally know what caused the global tech outage
- and how much it cost
CNN —
Insurers have begun calculating the financial damage caused by last week’s devastating CrowdStrike software glitch that crashed computers, canceled flights and disrupted hospitals all around the globe — and the picture isn’t pretty.
What’s been described as the largest IT outage in history will cost Fortune 500 companies alone more than $5 billion in direct losses, according to one insurer’s analysis of the incident published Wednesday.
Numerous Fortune 500 companies use CrowdStrike’s cybersecurity software to detect and block hacking threats. But when CrowdStrike issued an update last week to its signature cybersecurity software, known as Falcon, millions of computers around the world running Microsoft Windows crashed because of the way that the update interacted with Windows.
@ABooksNightmare Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem. There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective. You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process. Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
But you lose me when you start mentioning RNC when this issue should be an issue for all...I don't care what the RNC says or the DNC either...what I care about, and so should any American, is ensuring that voting is fair to those that are citizens...if obtaining an ID is all that is required I don't see that as a problem....in fact, that is minimal compared to what could be instituted...getting an ID should be something that any citizen should be willing and obligated to do....you generally would have to produce identification if you were asked by a peace officer, to obtain medicare, health insurance, use your credit card, etc...all things that are much more difficult to obtain...getting an ID is so low on the totem pole and is relatively easy to obtain...
If you don't push to have citizens prove that they can vote then you are allowing for potential fraud or corruption to be had, which is really the complaint....if it were be asked of citizens to donate blood and produce a DNA test then that would be unreasonable, but obtaining an ID to prove who you is low hanging fruit which is why I don't see it as a problem...put aside party lines and who is asking for what and be a citizen and ask yourself why would anyone complain about proving who you are to vote....you shouldn't and in fact, you should encourage it so you know elections and votes are being handled properly at the polls where you take the time out to vote...as I said, you can mail in your ballot as well, but you should have to prove that you can and are able to vote...it's a protection to do so for the voters as well, not just the results...
COVERS allows u to tell someone they are sexually frustrated so long as ur hands are clean
0
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@ABooksNightmare Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem. There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective. You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process. Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
But you lose me when you start mentioning RNC when this issue should be an issue for all...I don't care what the RNC says or the DNC either...what I care about, and so should any American, is ensuring that voting is fair to those that are citizens...if obtaining an ID is all that is required I don't see that as a problem....in fact, that is minimal compared to what could be instituted...getting an ID should be something that any citizen should be willing and obligated to do....you generally would have to produce identification if you were asked by a peace officer, to obtain medicare, health insurance, use your credit card, etc...all things that are much more difficult to obtain...getting an ID is so low on the totem pole and is relatively easy to obtain...
If you don't push to have citizens prove that they can vote then you are allowing for potential fraud or corruption to be had, which is really the complaint....if it were be asked of citizens to donate blood and produce a DNA test then that would be unreasonable, but obtaining an ID to prove who you is low hanging fruit which is why I don't see it as a problem...put aside party lines and who is asking for what and be a citizen and ask yourself why would anyone complain about proving who you are to vote....you shouldn't and in fact, you should encourage it so you know elections and votes are being handled properly at the polls where you take the time out to vote...as I said, you can mail in your ballot as well, but you should have to prove that you can and are able to vote...it's a protection to do so for the voters as well, not just the results...
Now, if one wants to argue that voter ID's should be issued for free from states then we can certainly discuss that, because that could be a viable topic for sure...however, voting should not be as easy as just walking up and voting without proving who you are...that leaves an integrity issue of the whole voting concept...your vote should count, yes, but showing that it is you voting and not someone else should be checked otherwise the voting system can and will be compromised....identity is important just about anywhere you go so why would voting be any different....I'm ashamed in California when I go to vote at a poll and they don't ask for my ID...I think it's ridiculous that a nation of our caliber and advancement is not concerned with making sure that my vote counts and is vetted...this isn't the 1800 or 1900's, this is 2024 and getting an identification should be a priority anyway, and if you want to vote then you have plenty of time to save and get it processed so your vote counts....
To say that it will deter people from voting is a bit of a stretch in mu opinion...if having to have an ID, which many already have by way of a driver license, then they were not that interested in voting to begin with...if we make everything so easy to do then it looses its value and lacks merit in my opinion...to allow this with voting would be no different that asking a bank to stop asking to prove it's you to withdrawal money from your account or for a merchant to stop asking for your Id to prove that it is your credit card to make a purchase or for a police officer to prove that it is you and that someone else is not using your name...why is it ok for these services to do so but not for voting? Seems like we are stuck in the stone ages and would rather it be convenient rather than what it should be and ensuring that my vote is vetted...
COVERS allows u to tell someone they are sexually frustrated so long as ur hands are clean
0
Now, if one wants to argue that voter ID's should be issued for free from states then we can certainly discuss that, because that could be a viable topic for sure...however, voting should not be as easy as just walking up and voting without proving who you are...that leaves an integrity issue of the whole voting concept...your vote should count, yes, but showing that it is you voting and not someone else should be checked otherwise the voting system can and will be compromised....identity is important just about anywhere you go so why would voting be any different....I'm ashamed in California when I go to vote at a poll and they don't ask for my ID...I think it's ridiculous that a nation of our caliber and advancement is not concerned with making sure that my vote counts and is vetted...this isn't the 1800 or 1900's, this is 2024 and getting an identification should be a priority anyway, and if you want to vote then you have plenty of time to save and get it processed so your vote counts....
To say that it will deter people from voting is a bit of a stretch in mu opinion...if having to have an ID, which many already have by way of a driver license, then they were not that interested in voting to begin with...if we make everything so easy to do then it looses its value and lacks merit in my opinion...to allow this with voting would be no different that asking a bank to stop asking to prove it's you to withdrawal money from your account or for a merchant to stop asking for your Id to prove that it is your credit card to make a purchase or for a police officer to prove that it is you and that someone else is not using your name...why is it ok for these services to do so but not for voting? Seems like we are stuck in the stone ages and would rather it be convenient rather than what it should be and ensuring that my vote is vetted...
@ABooksNightmare Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem. There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective. You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process. Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
Expect to see this again in November!
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Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@ABooksNightmare Here is the rub and it is a big rub. When you put qualifiers into the equation then it complicates the situation and it also gives legal ammo to the RNC to challenge the very qualifiers you are thinking solves the problem. So voter ID card as you mentioned is not even in the horizon and to think that the government can roll out a national system and make it comprehensive, easy and efficient is a big big problem. There is a LARGE population segment that will find this qualification quagmire to be a deterrent and yet another reason not to vote and thus it is an issue of suppression. One side on the political coin is pushing like a rabid dog for this and there is a blatant reason why. If you make the process more difficult and complex then less will vote and that reduces the voter pool and the demographic that are either not willing to go through hoops OR are not as intelligent to understand and complete this process, the RNC is banking on that being the DNC camp...there is no other logical reason why they are hunting this topic down like mad other than it gives them more advantage both from a registration perspective and a legal perspective. You cannot even float the concept that even if this were to somehow get put into play that the RNC will not abuse this and use it as cause to challenge losses they will have in the national and state elections. One of the most consistent concepts we see with elections is the RNC will cry foul on losses, it happens over and over and they will file legal claims they will tarnish the process and tarnish the officials and participants of the process. Nah the RNC does not care two craps about the concept of election purity, the goal should be the process is comprehensive AND EASY for every single citizen in every area and demographic of the US to participate in elections. This no question is a slick way to isolate and suppress the vote.
Over strict voter ID laws in several states have been overturned in courts because of discrimination against minorities. Voting suppression is a far greater problem than electoral integrity and extremely rare voting fraud. Millions or 6-11% of eligible voters lack government photo ID according to Brennan center. Government photo ID cards aren't equally easy for everyone to get. Costs range from $20 to $1500 each even if cards are free. But voting is supposed to be a right for eligible voters. Not a privilege such as air travel or bank withdrawal. That is why some states accept alternative identifications such as utility bill, birth certificate, student card, bank statement or government document.
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Over strict voter ID laws in several states have been overturned in courts because of discrimination against minorities. Voting suppression is a far greater problem than electoral integrity and extremely rare voting fraud. Millions or 6-11% of eligible voters lack government photo ID according to Brennan center. Government photo ID cards aren't equally easy for everyone to get. Costs range from $20 to $1500 each even if cards are free. But voting is supposed to be a right for eligible voters. Not a privilege such as air travel or bank withdrawal. That is why some states accept alternative identifications such as utility bill, birth certificate, student card, bank statement or government document.
Over strict voter ID laws in several states have been overturned in courts because of discrimination against minorities. Voting suppression is a far greater problem than electoral integrity and extremely rare voting fraud. Millions or 6-11% of eligible voters lack government photo ID according to Brennan center. Government photo ID cards aren't equally easy for everyone to get. Costs range from $20 to $1500 each even if cards are free. But voting is supposed to be a right for eligible voters. Not a privilege such as air travel or bank withdrawal. That is why some states accept alternative identifications such as utility bill, birth certificate, student card, bank statement or government document.
You have to have ID to get low income assistance, so why is it discriminating? And more white people are on assistance programs, because whites make up a larger percentage of the population. So why is it discrimination against minorities?
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Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:
Over strict voter ID laws in several states have been overturned in courts because of discrimination against minorities. Voting suppression is a far greater problem than electoral integrity and extremely rare voting fraud. Millions or 6-11% of eligible voters lack government photo ID according to Brennan center. Government photo ID cards aren't equally easy for everyone to get. Costs range from $20 to $1500 each even if cards are free. But voting is supposed to be a right for eligible voters. Not a privilege such as air travel or bank withdrawal. That is why some states accept alternative identifications such as utility bill, birth certificate, student card, bank statement or government document.
You have to have ID to get low income assistance, so why is it discriminating? And more white people are on assistance programs, because whites make up a larger percentage of the population. So why is it discrimination against minorities?
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