This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
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This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
moscowneeds strong centralgovernment, europe needs a strong central government the english empire needs strong central govenment the pro central government is always afraid to let go any control.. cause power isd what these people are running for and that power is fadingg... like every other democratic nation... i sure the peoples republic of china is having the same debate of a strong centralgovernment.
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Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
moscowneeds strong centralgovernment, europe needs a strong central government the english empire needs strong central govenment the pro central government is always afraid to let go any control.. cause power isd what these people are running for and that power is fadingg... like every other democratic nation... i sure the peoples republic of china is having the same debate of a strong centralgovernment.
moscowneeds strong centralgovernment, europe needs a strong central government the english empire needs strong central govenment the pro central government is always afraid to let go any control.. cause power isd what these people are running for and that power is fadingg... like every other democratic nation... i sure the peoples republic of china is having the same debate of a strong centralgovernment.
So are you going to start making sense sometime soon? This makes no sense and has nothing to do with the subject.
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
moscowneeds strong centralgovernment, europe needs a strong central government the english empire needs strong central govenment the pro central government is always afraid to let go any control.. cause power isd what these people are running for and that power is fadingg... like every other democratic nation... i sure the peoples republic of china is having the same debate of a strong centralgovernment.
So are you going to start making sense sometime soon? This makes no sense and has nothing to do with the subject.
O.K This bill allows states to choose what plan suites their State. If affordable care works they can keep it. It sets up a purse that becomes a tax credit. It allows all citizens to have coverage in all states through medicaid with individuals and corporations adding to basic Health coverage.
But it doesn't mandate any state to do anything that their elected constituents would support or not support. thus allowing states to choose and not the central government mandates.
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O.K This bill allows states to choose what plan suites their State. If affordable care works they can keep it. It sets up a purse that becomes a tax credit. It allows all citizens to have coverage in all states through medicaid with individuals and corporations adding to basic Health coverage.
But it doesn't mandate any state to do anything that their elected constituents would support or not support. thus allowing states to choose and not the central government mandates.
See you are saying the solution is to take the big problem from this building (feds) and move it to 50 buildings (states) and that will solve the problem which has nothing to do with who is administering the benefit.
The issue isnt fed vs state at all or you would not see a steady, regular pattern of healthcare inflation over several decades...
Switching from fed to state when states have not proven capable of doing things more efficiently is stupid.
Solve the problem of cost containment and benefit equity..that is the only problem that needs addressing.
I also would be very nervous putting this issue at the feet of states who have a history of not properly administering or funding or managing things...and that means every single state in the union.
Gotta love GOPs who think the solution to all ills is to take from the feds and give to the states and POOF everything is all better.
What a bunch of crap..
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See you are saying the solution is to take the big problem from this building (feds) and move it to 50 buildings (states) and that will solve the problem which has nothing to do with who is administering the benefit.
The issue isnt fed vs state at all or you would not see a steady, regular pattern of healthcare inflation over several decades...
Switching from fed to state when states have not proven capable of doing things more efficiently is stupid.
Solve the problem of cost containment and benefit equity..that is the only problem that needs addressing.
I also would be very nervous putting this issue at the feet of states who have a history of not properly administering or funding or managing things...and that means every single state in the union.
Gotta love GOPs who think the solution to all ills is to take from the feds and give to the states and POOF everything is all better.
I would rather have fifty individual entities tackle the matter than one.
These states are alot closer to their citizens than Washington is to the citizen. States like Maine can support and fund what works in maine,
Like wise states like California and New York can deal with this issue as they can see support for. Taking power from Washington and giving it to state control is apart of the constitution. Those that said lets cut out the Middle men are not revealing the middle men dole this benifit out anyway. for the same cost as Medicaid all citizens can have the same coverage benifit to the Feds.
Reduction is that individuals will know the cost of the service and if this cost is provided less expensively at a different facility allowing markets to compete for procedures.
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I would rather have fifty individual entities tackle the matter than one.
These states are alot closer to their citizens than Washington is to the citizen. States like Maine can support and fund what works in maine,
Like wise states like California and New York can deal with this issue as they can see support for. Taking power from Washington and giving it to state control is apart of the constitution. Those that said lets cut out the Middle men are not revealing the middle men dole this benifit out anyway. for the same cost as Medicaid all citizens can have the same coverage benifit to the Feds.
Reduction is that individuals will know the cost of the service and if this cost is provided less expensively at a different facility allowing markets to compete for procedures.
Reduction is that individuals will know the cost of the service and if this cost is provided less expensively at a different facility allowing markets to compete for procedures.
You mean, individuals now don't know the cost of the service? Suddenly, things will change?
Is this like when you said that cross market competition is going to solve the problem? Unlike what exists now where you have...well, cross market competition.
Stop being a right wing sheep and learn to think for yourself.
Health insurance cannot ever be solely controlled by the States because a person receives health care no matter what state they are in. That expense and cost is coming from somewhere.
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
Reduction is that individuals will know the cost of the service and if this cost is provided less expensively at a different facility allowing markets to compete for procedures.
You mean, individuals now don't know the cost of the service? Suddenly, things will change?
Is this like when you said that cross market competition is going to solve the problem? Unlike what exists now where you have...well, cross market competition.
Stop being a right wing sheep and learn to think for yourself.
Health insurance cannot ever be solely controlled by the States because a person receives health care no matter what state they are in. That expense and cost is coming from somewhere.
You mean, individuals now don't know the cost of the service? Suddenly, things will change?
Is this like when you said that cross market competition is going to solve the problem? Unlike what exists now where you have...well, cross market competition.
Stop being a right wing sheep and learn to think for yourself.
Health insurance cannot ever be solely controlled by the States because a person receives health care no matter what state they are in. That expense and cost is coming from somewhere.
if every policy sold was valued by the carrier at a certain percentage. for risk cost managemnt as it does. t hen every policy was adjusted to off set those with in the group with risk factors and pre-existing condition as is necessary for entry physcal and drug screenings. smoking diabetes ect. this then becomes to the pool to insure high risk procedure clients the same formula to govern high risk drivers in states require all have drivers insurance to be able to drive an automobile can apply to having all needing health care coverage with in their states.
as for ar ight wing sheeple, I was against Hillary does not ever mean i will ever care to go hunting with cheney in rumsfelds range in western Florida. Nor ever Dine in a 1000 plate gathering to reelct McConnell during the Kentucky derby.
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
You mean, individuals now don't know the cost of the service? Suddenly, things will change?
Is this like when you said that cross market competition is going to solve the problem? Unlike what exists now where you have...well, cross market competition.
Stop being a right wing sheep and learn to think for yourself.
Health insurance cannot ever be solely controlled by the States because a person receives health care no matter what state they are in. That expense and cost is coming from somewhere.
if every policy sold was valued by the carrier at a certain percentage. for risk cost managemnt as it does. t hen every policy was adjusted to off set those with in the group with risk factors and pre-existing condition as is necessary for entry physcal and drug screenings. smoking diabetes ect. this then becomes to the pool to insure high risk procedure clients the same formula to govern high risk drivers in states require all have drivers insurance to be able to drive an automobile can apply to having all needing health care coverage with in their states.
as for ar ight wing sheeple, I was against Hillary does not ever mean i will ever care to go hunting with cheney in rumsfelds range in western Florida. Nor ever Dine in a 1000 plate gathering to reelct McConnell during the Kentucky derby.
Procedure costs can be negotiated by medicaid to instuct what facilities are allowed for compensation . by regulating the industry through fair market procedure costs all will know what the cost for treatment is what the policy will pay and what will be out of pocket before the receptionists ask for insurance information.
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Procedure costs can be negotiated by medicaid to instuct what facilities are allowed for compensation . by regulating the industry through fair market procedure costs all will know what the cost for treatment is what the policy will pay and what will be out of pocket before the receptionists ask for insurance information.
This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
The Federal government states and the states must comply, This issue was settled in the civil war. But the fed gives state control of Drivers Liscences, It gives control on health providors liscenscenses how to collect and enforce Child support. How much does the state already do?
Federal government can not keep a dollar on the books but if politicians in Washington like Lord Nelson do no tbelieve the state that sent him can not decide for themselves then he never intended to apply the will of the people to state.For he is above that he is there to protect what opinion if it was not the people of the state that sent him to washington.
If our public institutions have become detatched from the citizens that support them. i DO NOT BELIEVE THEY EVER INTENDED TO DO THE PEOPLES WORK BUT THEIR WORK IN WASHINGTON.
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Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
This is like getting a blue color deck of cards vs a red color deck..
Nothing changes, just the color of the deck of cards.
Giving states control of anything when they have no history of being more efficient AND doing a better job of safeguarding citizen rights is moronic.
I dont get why you GOP boys are so seemingly gullible and are not able to think clearly, the solution to healthcare is not to take the problem from one entity and shift it to another and think magically things will improve.
The Federal government states and the states must comply, This issue was settled in the civil war. But the fed gives state control of Drivers Liscences, It gives control on health providors liscenscenses how to collect and enforce Child support. How much does the state already do?
Federal government can not keep a dollar on the books but if politicians in Washington like Lord Nelson do no tbelieve the state that sent him can not decide for themselves then he never intended to apply the will of the people to state.For he is above that he is there to protect what opinion if it was not the people of the state that sent him to washington.
If our public institutions have become detatched from the citizens that support them. i DO NOT BELIEVE THEY EVER INTENDED TO DO THE PEOPLES WORK BUT THEIR WORK IN WASHINGTON.
they were talking about this on bloomberg this morning (along with the other huge problem- long term debt). they said this collins plan was short on details (i know, big surprise) and didn't make much sense. other than the state issue already discussed, it seemed to rely heavily on health savings accounts.
i'm not sure i understand how that solves the problem. i need surgery that's going to cost $100,000. i can't afford it now, but if i get a health savings account, now i can afford it?
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they were talking about this on bloomberg this morning (along with the other huge problem- long term debt). they said this collins plan was short on details (i know, big surprise) and didn't make much sense. other than the state issue already discussed, it seemed to rely heavily on health savings accounts.
i'm not sure i understand how that solves the problem. i need surgery that's going to cost $100,000. i can't afford it now, but if i get a health savings account, now i can afford it?
this is what we have a basic policy costs a family of four 3,500 the deductable is 6000 so 9,500 has to be spent before insurance pays anything. then a catostrophic care coverage kicks in with very few policies allowing for medication. Meanwhile the feds pay states block grants to apply Medicaid coverage. That Medicaid coverage is for abject poverty stricken individuals who live with less than half of poverty level. their benifit is any procedure drug or cost is given to them. no mention for any costs for it costs nothing for treatment.
they can pay up to 100 g for mental patiant in hospital treatment for depression .if they gave the abject poverty stricken individual the 100 g i am sure he would not be depressed or he just go on a bender and end up dead any way.
but what fun would that be they are subsidizing medicine and nurses, dr, cna, orderlies, sanitation workers ect. with this subsidy.
ifthey took this subsidy and extended it to all with the same block grant it would force the states to control costs by stating howmuch the state pays and how much will be owed to the medical providors and the people seeking treatment. By negotiating with PIG pharma, the cost of medicine can be forced lower or forced out.
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this is what we have a basic policy costs a family of four 3,500 the deductable is 6000 so 9,500 has to be spent before insurance pays anything. then a catostrophic care coverage kicks in with very few policies allowing for medication. Meanwhile the feds pay states block grants to apply Medicaid coverage. That Medicaid coverage is for abject poverty stricken individuals who live with less than half of poverty level. their benifit is any procedure drug or cost is given to them. no mention for any costs for it costs nothing for treatment.
they can pay up to 100 g for mental patiant in hospital treatment for depression .if they gave the abject poverty stricken individual the 100 g i am sure he would not be depressed or he just go on a bender and end up dead any way.
but what fun would that be they are subsidizing medicine and nurses, dr, cna, orderlies, sanitation workers ect. with this subsidy.
ifthey took this subsidy and extended it to all with the same block grant it would force the states to control costs by stating howmuch the state pays and how much will be owed to the medical providors and the people seeking treatment. By negotiating with PIG pharma, the cost of medicine can be forced lower or forced out.
let just take an example of how much the lobbyist have screwed this up at Washington. our medicine for heart condition is plavix better than comadine .
this is madein mexico and canada for the north american market. but an individual with a legit script can be fined and jailed for crossing the border and buying lower price medicine. Why? meantime Medicare the primary mechanism to buy this drug in mass bulk is not allowed to negotiating a price with Pharmaceutical, and PIG pharma did not develop the med in the first place we paid that through research grants at the world health organization at the national level. and directly to the universities band trial clinics for studies funded all by the us taxpayer.and now we get to pay the most in the entire world for the damn drug.
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let just take an example of how much the lobbyist have screwed this up at Washington. our medicine for heart condition is plavix better than comadine .
this is madein mexico and canada for the north american market. but an individual with a legit script can be fined and jailed for crossing the border and buying lower price medicine. Why? meantime Medicare the primary mechanism to buy this drug in mass bulk is not allowed to negotiating a price with Pharmaceutical, and PIG pharma did not develop the med in the first place we paid that through research grants at the world health organization at the national level. and directly to the universities band trial clinics for studies funded all by the us taxpayer.and now we get to pay the most in the entire world for the damn drug.
this is what we have a basic policy costs a family of four 3,500 the deductable is 6000 so 9,500 has to be spent before insurance pays anything. then a catostrophic care coverage kicks in with very few policies allowing for medication. Meanwhile the feds pay states block grants to apply Medicaid coverage. That Medicaid coverage is for abject poverty stricken individuals who live with less than half of poverty level. their benifit is any procedure drug or cost is given to them. no mention for any costs for it costs nothing for treatment.
they can pay up to 100 g for mental patiant in hospital treatment for depression .if they gave the abject poverty stricken individual the 100 g i am sure he would not be depressed or he just go on a bender and end up dead any way.
but what fun would that be they are subsidizing medicine and nurses, dr, cna, orderlies, sanitation workers ect. with this subsidy.
ifthey took this subsidy and extended it to all with the same block grant it would force the states to control costs by stating howmuch the state pays and how much will be owed to the medical providors and the people seeking treatment. By negotiating with PIG pharma, the cost of medicine can be forced lower or forced out.
This is an extremely naive view of depression.
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
this is what we have a basic policy costs a family of four 3,500 the deductable is 6000 so 9,500 has to be spent before insurance pays anything. then a catostrophic care coverage kicks in with very few policies allowing for medication. Meanwhile the feds pay states block grants to apply Medicaid coverage. That Medicaid coverage is for abject poverty stricken individuals who live with less than half of poverty level. their benifit is any procedure drug or cost is given to them. no mention for any costs for it costs nothing for treatment.
they can pay up to 100 g for mental patiant in hospital treatment for depression .if they gave the abject poverty stricken individual the 100 g i am sure he would not be depressed or he just go on a bender and end up dead any way.
but what fun would that be they are subsidizing medicine and nurses, dr, cna, orderlies, sanitation workers ect. with this subsidy.
ifthey took this subsidy and extended it to all with the same block grant it would force the states to control costs by stating howmuch the state pays and how much will be owed to the medical providors and the people seeking treatment. By negotiating with PIG pharma, the cost of medicine can be forced lower or forced out.
reality we do not give a flying fornication for cowards. but reality see those deer in the avater. somehave died since the picture was posted a packof coyotes ate that hapless creature from its arsh to its neck as that creature winessed his consumption by the pack.
i am sure had it occured to the animal it would of prayed for suicide by hunter in that cicumstance. and would realize it was better to be struck by a tractor trailer the night before than toendit this way....
king of hearts in that deck of yours represents the executioner. ....
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reality we do not give a flying fornication for cowards. but reality see those deer in the avater. somehave died since the picture was posted a packof coyotes ate that hapless creature from its arsh to its neck as that creature winessed his consumption by the pack.
i am sure had it occured to the animal it would of prayed for suicide by hunter in that cicumstance. and would realize it was better to be struck by a tractor trailer the night before than toendit this way....
king of hearts in that deck of yours represents the executioner. ....
see all of them the herd is that large due to amans efforts he buys grain putson back of snowmobile cuts a hole in the bottom and rides up that trail. why we clear cut the woods behind it. we took away those creatures shelter took all the walls down around their house went into their fridge and completely removed allthe food .
and left that herd with no food no shelter and 72 inches of snow. if had not been for this mans efforts those deer would starve and freeze to death and all peta and biologists state is man should not feed and interfere with the deer or its population... that beuti rode strip is a small sliver of woods.
apply that to your masses of humans enduring the same fate... and get back to me about my depression pal.
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see all of them the herd is that large due to amans efforts he buys grain putson back of snowmobile cuts a hole in the bottom and rides up that trail. why we clear cut the woods behind it. we took away those creatures shelter took all the walls down around their house went into their fridge and completely removed allthe food .
and left that herd with no food no shelter and 72 inches of snow. if had not been for this mans efforts those deer would starve and freeze to death and all peta and biologists state is man should not feed and interfere with the deer or its population... that beuti rode strip is a small sliver of woods.
apply that to your masses of humans enduring the same fate... and get back to me about my depression pal.
then after that entire rant above. what if???? what if it was so much worse than you could ever concieve. what if you did not die. what if you just woke upin a past situation you could not explain why completely lost reality and realized you were in somesimiliar place but little things that only your ocd mind could pick out were a bit off. a new house there your family members do not quite look the same. you were in a situation and experienced a similiar but just off situation but it happened that you do not remeber anything but that you had a bad dream, and everything happpens to repeat to lead you to the same point many years later and you find yourself facing the decisioned. to move to the next day.
what if the whole thing was like a big behind game and when you lose you start over from a fixed point and move back through to the present... and it just never ends...
your stuck in a ground hogs century to get it right?
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Quote Originally Posted by Ktrain:
This is an extremely naive view of depression.
then after that entire rant above. what if???? what if it was so much worse than you could ever concieve. what if you did not die. what if you just woke upin a past situation you could not explain why completely lost reality and realized you were in somesimiliar place but little things that only your ocd mind could pick out were a bit off. a new house there your family members do not quite look the same. you were in a situation and experienced a similiar but just off situation but it happened that you do not remeber anything but that you had a bad dream, and everything happpens to repeat to lead you to the same point many years later and you find yourself facing the decisioned. to move to the next day.
what if the whole thing was like a big behind game and when you lose you start over from a fixed point and move back through to the present... and it just never ends...
your stuck in a ground hogs century to get it right?
and finally you have found the depth of ybsane mentality.
you made it tocloud city, or a hidden valley ordirt city a ville in a place to wait for ice cream , and you realize you do not belong there. you end up back on this god forsaken marble with one theme. "Help these people."
you can not just slaughter the rich tried that in france around 1790's not so good results. can not get anyone to improve their condition asking anyone or anything at thispoint to put away 75 a week is like moving mount Rushmore to vegas.
saying if your in a flood zone build your house above the water line,,, but it costs... costs what paper... even better digitson an computer account screen?
so fed upsometimes with the entire endevor i like to quit... and I can not.
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and finally you have found the depth of ybsane mentality.
you made it tocloud city, or a hidden valley ordirt city a ville in a place to wait for ice cream , and you realize you do not belong there. you end up back on this god forsaken marble with one theme. "Help these people."
you can not just slaughter the rich tried that in france around 1790's not so good results. can not get anyone to improve their condition asking anyone or anything at thispoint to put away 75 a week is like moving mount Rushmore to vegas.
saying if your in a flood zone build your house above the water line,,, but it costs... costs what paper... even better digitson an computer account screen?
so fed upsometimes with the entire endevor i like to quit... and I can not.
The replacement is the old system with the same problems. US would still have the most inefficient and unaffordable healthcare system in the world with many Americans uninsured or under insured.
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The replacement is the old system with the same problems. US would still have the most inefficient and unaffordable healthcare system in the world with many Americans uninsured or under insured.
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