Employees getting their hours cut...Check Employees getting their benefits eliminated...Check Employees losing their jobs all together...Check Adding more people to the government dependency list...Check
Employees getting their hours cut...Check Employees getting their benefits eliminated...Check Employees losing their jobs all together...Check Adding more people to the government dependency list...Check
Did you read the piece, check for independent supportive stats, counter-check those with other sources, or were you too busy drooling in front of the TV when you saw Fox.
Perhaps one of your New Years resolutions is to become well versed in various news sources.
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I am so shocked you cited a Fox opinion piece.
Did you read the piece, check for independent supportive stats, counter-check those with other sources, or were you too busy drooling in front of the TV when you saw Fox.
Perhaps one of your New Years resolutions is to become well versed in various news sources.
Did you read the piece, check for independent supportive stats, counter-check those with other sources, or were you too busy drooling in front of the TV when you saw Fox.
Perhaps one of your New Years resolutions is to become well versed in various news sources.
This is a good post. What would make it better is if "Fox" was also accompanied by...MSNBC,CNN, Newsvine,DailyKOS, ThinkProgress, DailyBeast, and any other "unbiased" networks or affiliates. In the interest of fairness, I'm sure this was only a slight oversight.
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
I am so shocked you cited a Fox opinion piece.
Did you read the piece, check for independent supportive stats, counter-check those with other sources, or were you too busy drooling in front of the TV when you saw Fox.
Perhaps one of your New Years resolutions is to become well versed in various news sources.
This is a good post. What would make it better is if "Fox" was also accompanied by...MSNBC,CNN, Newsvine,DailyKOS, ThinkProgress, DailyBeast, and any other "unbiased" networks or affiliates. In the interest of fairness, I'm sure this was only a slight oversight.
This is a good post. What would make it better is if "Fox" was also accompanied by...MSNBC,CNN, Newsvine,DailyKOS, ThinkProgress, DailyBeast, and any other "unbiased" networks or affiliates. In the interest of fairness, I'm sure this was only a slight oversight.
For someone who likes to proclaim themselves as not part of the partisan gang, you come across pretty "right." Realistically, there are enough posters who proclaim all right wing Republican ideas good and all others bad. Maybe you have a post that doesn't exemplify that. Please link if you do.
But I'll show you and the others how its done. Watch and learn. Teach your kids.
The problem with the argument about raising the minimum wage is that, statistically, it doesn't really solve the problem of making ends meet. The rate of increasing of wages has not risen exponentially with the cost of living in so many years that slight increases now don't account for meeting ends. See https://www.cbo.gov/publication/22010
So it becomes lip service by politicians designed to make certain groups feel that they are supporting the poor worker more than they really are.
Most analysts will tell you that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives that provide relief for expenses they would incur anyway, which will allow for more money in each paycheck and does not create an artificial business environment.
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Quote Originally Posted by potter36:
This is a good post. What would make it better is if "Fox" was also accompanied by...MSNBC,CNN, Newsvine,DailyKOS, ThinkProgress, DailyBeast, and any other "unbiased" networks or affiliates. In the interest of fairness, I'm sure this was only a slight oversight.
For someone who likes to proclaim themselves as not part of the partisan gang, you come across pretty "right." Realistically, there are enough posters who proclaim all right wing Republican ideas good and all others bad. Maybe you have a post that doesn't exemplify that. Please link if you do.
But I'll show you and the others how its done. Watch and learn. Teach your kids.
The problem with the argument about raising the minimum wage is that, statistically, it doesn't really solve the problem of making ends meet. The rate of increasing of wages has not risen exponentially with the cost of living in so many years that slight increases now don't account for meeting ends. See https://www.cbo.gov/publication/22010
So it becomes lip service by politicians designed to make certain groups feel that they are supporting the poor worker more than they really are.
Most analysts will tell you that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives that provide relief for expenses they would incur anyway, which will allow for more money in each paycheck and does not create an artificial business environment.
susprised to see cano making a thread in favor of raising the minimum wage since he understands, as we all do, that anything even remotely characterized as a foxnewsdisease opinion piece is going to be the opposite of the truth, if it's coherent at all.
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susprised to see cano making a thread in favor of raising the minimum wage since he understands, as we all do, that anything even remotely characterized as a foxnewsdisease opinion piece is going to be the opposite of the truth, if it's coherent at all.
For someone who likes to proclaim themselves as not part of the partisan gang, you come across pretty "right." Realistically, there are enough posters who proclaim all right wing Republican ideas good and all others bad. Maybe you have a post that doesn't exemplify that. Please link if you do.
But I'll show you and the others how its done. Watch and learn. Teach your kids.
The problem with the argument about raising the minimum wage is that, statistically, it doesn't really solve the problem of making ends meet. The rate of increasing of wages has not risen exponentially with the cost of living in so many years that slight increases now don't account for meeting ends. See https://www.cbo.gov/publication/22010
So it becomes lip service by politicians designed to make certain groups feel that they are supporting the poor worker more than they really are.
Most analysts will tell you that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives that provide relief for expenses they would incur anyway, which will allow for more money in each paycheck and does not create an artificial business environment.
DJ, I'll be the first to say, I lean more right in terms of fiscal responsibility. What I didn't do in that post was say backup FOX, I was simply making it a point that what one might say about a single outlet, might also be applied to absolute left leaning outlets. You'll have to forgive me, It's just that I don't see the same reaction to the left leaning posters who reference their links to admitted left leaning sights. If I have missed it, I would be the first to admit it. Regardless this is simply a site for opinion and full of to many people that take themselves way too seriously.
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
For someone who likes to proclaim themselves as not part of the partisan gang, you come across pretty "right." Realistically, there are enough posters who proclaim all right wing Republican ideas good and all others bad. Maybe you have a post that doesn't exemplify that. Please link if you do.
But I'll show you and the others how its done. Watch and learn. Teach your kids.
The problem with the argument about raising the minimum wage is that, statistically, it doesn't really solve the problem of making ends meet. The rate of increasing of wages has not risen exponentially with the cost of living in so many years that slight increases now don't account for meeting ends. See https://www.cbo.gov/publication/22010
So it becomes lip service by politicians designed to make certain groups feel that they are supporting the poor worker more than they really are.
Most analysts will tell you that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives that provide relief for expenses they would incur anyway, which will allow for more money in each paycheck and does not create an artificial business environment.
DJ, I'll be the first to say, I lean more right in terms of fiscal responsibility. What I didn't do in that post was say backup FOX, I was simply making it a point that what one might say about a single outlet, might also be applied to absolute left leaning outlets. You'll have to forgive me, It's just that I don't see the same reaction to the left leaning posters who reference their links to admitted left leaning sights. If I have missed it, I would be the first to admit it. Regardless this is simply a site for opinion and full of to many people that take themselves way too seriously.
One final thing, I made no comment as to the pro or con of raising the minimum wage or did I say anything to agree with the OP. Thanks for showing me how its done. Happy New Year.
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One final thing, I made no comment as to the pro or con of raising the minimum wage or did I say anything to agree with the OP. Thanks for showing me how its done. Happy New Year.
i don't really have an opinion about minimum wage either. i don't understand all of the ramifications. i just didn't want to miss an opportunity to mess with cano. i know he wouldn't want me to.
but i have seen charts, articles and such things talking about how corporate profits are at an all time high yet wages are at an all time low. and, wages have not changed in many years as adjusted for inflation. if true, that seems to suggest the game is rigged and the poor and middle class are getting the short end. we know our system doesn't even resemble the free market capitalism we learned in school that should have been taught in mythology class rather than history or economics.
but i'm not expert on this. i'll defer to dj and the opposite of whatever foxnews says.
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i don't really have an opinion about minimum wage either. i don't understand all of the ramifications. i just didn't want to miss an opportunity to mess with cano. i know he wouldn't want me to.
but i have seen charts, articles and such things talking about how corporate profits are at an all time high yet wages are at an all time low. and, wages have not changed in many years as adjusted for inflation. if true, that seems to suggest the game is rigged and the poor and middle class are getting the short end. we know our system doesn't even resemble the free market capitalism we learned in school that should have been taught in mythology class rather than history or economics.
but i'm not expert on this. i'll defer to dj and the opposite of whatever foxnews says.
The minimum wage is a destructive policy that preys on the very people is designed to protect e.i.the unskilled and uneducated...
Milton Friedman’s definition of the minimum wage is a law that essentially, makes it illegal to hire someone whose work is valued at less than a determined amount.
In fact 79% of all economists agree that a minimum wage hurts more than it helps. (Mankiw, 2009) https://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2009/02/news-flash-economists-agree.html Mankiw professor and chairman of the economics department at Harvard University...
The government should not get involved..only American style free market can determine what wages should be. What we really need to do is abolish the minimum wage altogether and let employers pay their employees what they are really worth...the results could lead to less people being unemployed...and higher wages .... Employers have an incentive to pay a competitive wage to get the best workers possible that can generate the most profit..
Automatically raising workers pay to $15 an hour will only end up getting the less skilled and the less-educated fired and more skilled and educated workers hired ...
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The minimum wage is a destructive policy that preys on the very people is designed to protect e.i.the unskilled and uneducated...
Milton Friedman’s definition of the minimum wage is a law that essentially, makes it illegal to hire someone whose work is valued at less than a determined amount.
In fact 79% of all economists agree that a minimum wage hurts more than it helps. (Mankiw, 2009) https://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2009/02/news-flash-economists-agree.html Mankiw professor and chairman of the economics department at Harvard University...
The government should not get involved..only American style free market can determine what wages should be. What we really need to do is abolish the minimum wage altogether and let employers pay their employees what they are really worth...the results could lead to less people being unemployed...and higher wages .... Employers have an incentive to pay a competitive wage to get the best workers possible that can generate the most profit..
Automatically raising workers pay to $15 an hour will only end up getting the less skilled and the less-educated fired and more skilled and educated workers hired ...
I would be curious to see which employers / jobs hire for minimum wage- Then- look at margins these companies work with... Raising the minimum wage for their least qualified employees will cut into their margins- meaning fewer poorly qualified employees still making a meager wage- Doesn't sound like the answer....
I would think rather than raising an artificial floor- perhaps more programs designed to make these lower level employees qualified for better paying jobs would be a better solution-
Of course, that assumes that said employees would take advantage of such programs-
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I would be curious to see which employers / jobs hire for minimum wage- Then- look at margins these companies work with... Raising the minimum wage for their least qualified employees will cut into their margins- meaning fewer poorly qualified employees still making a meager wage- Doesn't sound like the answer....
I would think rather than raising an artificial floor- perhaps more programs designed to make these lower level employees qualified for better paying jobs would be a better solution-
Of course, that assumes that said employees would take advantage of such programs-
if record corporate profits are at an all time high and wages are at an all time low, doesn't that suggest that some significant percentage of those profits come from cutting costs, i.e. employees? and if consumer spending is the biggest segment of our economy, won;t this bite us in the behind at some point?
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if record corporate profits are at an all time high and wages are at an all time low, doesn't that suggest that some significant percentage of those profits come from cutting costs, i.e. employees? and if consumer spending is the biggest segment of our economy, won;t this bite us in the behind at some point?
i don't really have an opinion about minimum wage either. i don't understand all of the ramifications. i just didn't want to miss an opportunity to mess with cano. i know he wouldn't want me to.
but i have seen charts, articles and such things talking about how corporate profits are at an all time high yet wages are at an all time low. and, wages have not changed in many years as adjusted for inflation. if true, that seems to suggest the game is rigged and the poor and middle class are getting the short end. we know our system doesn't even resemble the free market capitalism we learned in school that should have been taught in mythology class rather than history or economics.
but i'm not expert on this. i'll defer to dj and the opposite of whatever foxnews says.
I'm assuming every year the charts and articles you are looking at say the same thing every year...
Corporate Profits at an All Time High
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Quote Originally Posted by ClubDirt:
i don't really have an opinion about minimum wage either. i don't understand all of the ramifications. i just didn't want to miss an opportunity to mess with cano. i know he wouldn't want me to.
but i have seen charts, articles and such things talking about how corporate profits are at an all time high yet wages are at an all time low. and, wages have not changed in many years as adjusted for inflation. if true, that seems to suggest the game is rigged and the poor and middle class are getting the short end. we know our system doesn't even resemble the free market capitalism we learned in school that should have been taught in mythology class rather than history or economics.
but i'm not expert on this. i'll defer to dj and the opposite of whatever foxnews says.
I'm assuming every year the charts and articles you are looking at say the same thing every year...
Kudos to dj... tax incentives is a very good idea verses raising the minimum wage, really had not thought of it that way, but good idea... I am not for raising the minimum wage but do believe there should be a way to help those that make the least...
I am normally a "if they want more money, then get an education" type guy... But as I get old I am more and more understanding that some people are just not brain-wise wired for higher education... They are not stupid or mentally challenged technically, just not the ones who will never be in charge or making innovative changes...
And Kudos to SarasotaSlim #12 ...
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Excellent thread...
Kudos to dj... tax incentives is a very good idea verses raising the minimum wage, really had not thought of it that way, but good idea... I am not for raising the minimum wage but do believe there should be a way to help those that make the least...
I am normally a "if they want more money, then get an education" type guy... But as I get old I am more and more understanding that some people are just not brain-wise wired for higher education... They are not stupid or mentally challenged technically, just not the ones who will never be in charge or making innovative changes...
if record corporate profits are at an all time high and wages are at an all time low, doesn't that suggest that some significant percentage of those profits come from cutting costs, i.e. employees? and if consumer spending is the biggest segment of our economy, won;t this bite us in the behind at some point?
How does the small business cope with liberals that want to punish profitability?
How does the small business survive with increase in labor costs with no increase in value for that expenditure?
If raising min wage to 15 per hour is good then why wouldn't a raise to 20 per hour be better? 50? 100?
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Quote Originally Posted by ClubDirt:
if record corporate profits are at an all time high and wages are at an all time low, doesn't that suggest that some significant percentage of those profits come from cutting costs, i.e. employees? and if consumer spending is the biggest segment of our economy, won;t this bite us in the behind at some point?
How does the small business cope with liberals that want to punish profitability?
How does the small business survive with increase in labor costs with no increase in value for that expenditure?
If raising min wage to 15 per hour is good then why wouldn't a raise to 20 per hour be better? 50? 100?
How does the small business cope with liberals that want to punish profitability?
How does the small business survive with increase in labor costs with no increase in value for that expenditure?
If raising min wage to 15 per hour is good then why wouldn't a raise to 20 per hour be better? 50? 100?
i'm not interested in getting into all that and i'm not arguing for an increased minimum wage. i am curious about those questions i asked if anyone has some greater economics knowledge.
to ask it another way, assuming wages have been mostly stagnant over the years, adjusted for inflation, and consumer spending is the biggest factor that drives our economy, isn't that a serious conflict that will seriously impair the economy at some point?
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Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
How does the small business cope with liberals that want to punish profitability?
How does the small business survive with increase in labor costs with no increase in value for that expenditure?
If raising min wage to 15 per hour is good then why wouldn't a raise to 20 per hour be better? 50? 100?
i'm not interested in getting into all that and i'm not arguing for an increased minimum wage. i am curious about those questions i asked if anyone has some greater economics knowledge.
to ask it another way, assuming wages have been mostly stagnant over the years, adjusted for inflation, and consumer spending is the biggest factor that drives our economy, isn't that a serious conflict that will seriously impair the economy at some point?
Djbrow is right on several points. First, tax credits are better in helping the poor than unfairly imposing burden on some industries instead of everyone.
Secondly, raising minimum wage isn't all bad if companies can overcome by becoming more cost efficient or producing more revenue. Higher costs doesn't always reduce employment.
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Djbrow is right on several points. First, tax credits are better in helping the poor than unfairly imposing burden on some industries instead of everyone.
Secondly, raising minimum wage isn't all bad if companies can overcome by becoming more cost efficient or producing more revenue. Higher costs doesn't always reduce employment.
Most analysts that say that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives...those analyst have to be rainbow and unicorn anal-ysts...because you cant put more money into the pay checks of people that don't pay income tax in the first place,,
This is just another liberal redistributed of wealth scheme,,and what we don't need is another government entitlement program ..
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Most analysts that say that the more effective way to help the minimum wage earner is with tax incentives...those analyst have to be rainbow and unicorn anal-ysts...because you cant put more money into the pay checks of people that don't pay income tax in the first place,,
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