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what is the purpose/function/utility of "health" "insurance"?

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Posted: #51
I wasnt making a personal jab, rather clarifying what they said.

You can eat perfectly, you can exercise all day and still have health problems.

I do not agree about the diet we are told to eat, I think dairy is questionable and eating meat is also questionable.

One other comment..you mentioned not eating sugar, I am assuming you mean refined sugar right? 

There are sugars in veggies and fruits, in milk etc..just not processed, refined sugars.


 
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Posted: #52

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



your post here is no more or less factual then mine


Ummm, except it is. There is nothing one can dispute about this quote:

"There is no guarantee of someone having a proper diet and perfect health..just as someone can have a bad diet and still have great health.

For sure a proper diet is beneficial in general but there are too many other variables which influence our outcomes than just what we eat."



 

 
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Posted: #53
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:

Ummm, except it is. There is nothing one can dispute about this quote:

"There is no guarantee of someone having a proper diet and perfect health..just as someone can have a bad diet and still have great health.

For sure a proper diet is beneficial in general but there are too many other variables which influence our outcomes than just what we eat."



 



well, if you say so. car to provide some evidence?
 
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Posted: #54
be,

Most people do not understand the replication process and how it is likely the cause of many health problems.

As our bodies cells continue to replicate, slight genetic modifications can happen and that can be why we have health problems.

Exposure to the sun, chemicals and the environment can also harm our health.

Too many variables outside of diet and exercise.


 
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Posted: #55
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

I wasnt making a personal jab, rather clarifying what they said.

You can eat perfectly, you can exercise all day and still have health problems.

I do not agree about the diet we are told to eat, I think dairy is questionable and eating meat is also questionable.

One other comment..you mentioned not eating sugar, I am assuming you mean refined sugar right? 

There are sugars in veggies and fruits, in milk etc..just not processed, refined sugars.




i know you didn't, we had a rare two+ page thread going that hadn't devolved into the usual mishmash, and it smelled like it was taking a turn towards the end of pg2, i would just like to keep it civil here

And yes, you are correct. I do consume some sugars, as they occur naturally, however i still limit them to what i consider reasonable levels, and otherwise go to great lengths to avoid sugars otherwise (expecially processed/refined crap)

This isn't about me. This is about us all, as American individuals
 
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Posted: #56

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



well, if you say so. car to provide some evidence?

Evidence that what?  Are you asking me to refute the notion that diet 100% controls one's health?

 

 
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Posted: #57
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:

Evidence that what?  Are you asking me to refute the notion that diet 100% controls one's health?

 



No, evidence that someone that lives a healthy lifestyle, will still get sick


 
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Posted: #58

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



No, evidence that someone that lives a healthy lifestyle, will still get sick


Substitute will for can.

 
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Posted: #59
Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



your post here is no more or less factual then mine


cd329 posted : First off you can eat all the perfect foods you want and still get sick with problems when you age.

to which is asked : Do you have any evidence of this?

to which djbrow said :  You're kidding, right?

to which is responded : not at all


Nutrition is an emotionally charged subject, and rightfully so, when the American populace has been misled for so long, by all the people that went to the most prestigious universities and spent so much time being 'educated' on the matter. Those are the people that many on this forum, claim we ought to be subjugating responsibility to, and in the real world, people did just that. look at the results, people are sick and dying in general, and not to mention quite confused as to why

SO in order for us to have this conversation, rather then allowing it devolve into personal jabs, first, wouldn't we have to define HEALTH, SICK, and what compromises "eating perfect"?


Be, you really cant be serious with this whole thread are you?
Where are you getting this info that if you eat a perfect diet you will have perfect health?  Also where are you getting the info as to what the perfect food to eat is?  Its all subjective, because what foods that are good for you, but not be good for the next person.
Plus you are leaving all the other things out that play a role in your health outside of of what you eat. Your genes and environment as 2 examples.  There is just so many other factors that play a  role in your health, its actually mind boggling.

To believe that if the world ate what Beeasy eats everyday, there would be no longer people becoming unhealthy really does make you a little insane {and thats not a bash at you}  If it was only just that easy, it would be great.

You think your real healthy now, because of what your eating, but the truth is, your probably real healthy right now, just because of your age.  When i was in my 20's and 30's i could eat anything i wanted to without ever putting on a pound or getting sick.

I also agree the food companies and the sugars are making us unhealthy and killing us, they are just doing faster then if when it come naturally.

Every person that is sick in a nursing home arent all there because they ate unhealthy.

also you never answered, why are you paying for insurance right now?  you could be saving that 5900 a year, being as how you really dont need it. I really cant figure out what you have it

 
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Posted: #60
Quote Originally Posted by cd329:



Be, you really cant be serious with this whole thread are you?
Where are you getting this info that if you eat a perfect diet you will have perfect health?  Also where are you getting the info as to what the perfect food to eat is?  Its all subjective, because what foods that are good for you, but not be good for the next person.
Plus you are leaving all the other things out that play a role in your health outside of of what you eat. Your genes and environment as 2 examples.  There is just so many other factors that play a  role in your health, its actually mind boggling.

To believe that if the world ate what Beeasy eats everyday, there would be no longer people becoming unhealthy really does make you a little insane {and thats not a bash at you}  If it was only just that easy, it would be great.

You think your real healthy now, because of what your eating, but the truth is, your probably real healthy right now, just because of your age.  When i was in my 20's and 30's i could eat anything i wanted to without ever putting on a pound or getting sick.

I also agree the food companies and the sugars are making us unhealthy and killing us, they are just doing faster then if when it come naturally.

Every person that is sick in a nursing home arent all there because they ate unhealthy.

also you never answered, why are you paying for insurance right now?  you could be saving that 5900 a year, being as how you really dont need it. I really cant figure out what you have it



please don't put words in my mouth

like i said, i continue to carry health insurance, because of tax policy. simple as that. Same reason why i bought a house, because of tax policy. Otherwise, the government forces me to pay for people that do have health insurance and mortgages anyways, so imagine the disadvantage they'd have me at if i didnt!!!
 
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Posted: #61
Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



please don't put words in my mouth

like i said, i continue to carry health insurance, because of tax policy. simple as that. Same reason why i bought a house, because of tax policy. Otherwise, the government forces me to pay for people that do have health insurance and mortgages anyways, so imagine the disadvantage they'd have me at if i didnt!!!


Am not putting words in your mouth.
Okay how does paying 6k for health insurance a year help you on your taxes that much?  I gotta believe you would make out better not paying the 6k a year.
Even if you can deduct the whole 6k off what you made, its still better to keep the 6k and pay the 28 percent[or whatever percent it is} in taxes on 6k more income you would show on your taxes.
I gotta believe you keep the insurance, in case you need it or else you would have dumped it until the time the govt forces you to take it.

also your house scenario doesnt make sense either. Why buy a house just to have your mortgage interest deducted off your taxes. Rent an apartment or house.
 
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Posted: #62
Why is it that both health insurance and public funding/taxes, are both so heavily married to incomes/wages?

I think that is my major gripe. Paying 6k per year (and the 5-10% annual increases) might make sense if health insurance was a lifetime plan. However, i know once i'm divorced form my current job, every dollar i've ever spent on health care vanishes into thin air. And i think that is evil

Not to mention, over 80% of all fed government revenue comes from taxes on wages. It is absurd to think that the working folk of this country should be required to carry the burden of paying for everyones government services AND their health insurance (soon to be one and the same)



WOuldn't it benefit the economy, and subsequently us all, to divorce both health insurance and government funding from the wages of those that perform all the labor that makes the world go round?
 
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Posted: #63
Quote Originally Posted by be easy:

Why is it that both health insurance and public funding/taxes, are both so heavily married to incomes/wages?

I think that is my major gripe. Paying 6k per year (and the 5-10% annual increases) might make sense if health insurance was a lifetime plan. However, i know once i'm divorced form my current job, every dollar i've ever spent on health care vanishes into thin air. And i think that is evil

Not to mention, over 80% of all fed government revenue comes from taxes on wages. It is absurd to think that the working folk of this country should be required to carry the burden of paying for everyones government services AND their health insurance (soon to be one and the same)



WOuldn't it benefit the economy, and subsequently us all, to divorce both health insurance and government funding from the wages of those that perform all the labor that makes the world go round?


I agree it would make sense to divorce health insurance from wages/labor.  The problem is that people are afraid to leave jobs, go on their own, take a break, whatever, because their health insurance is tied to their current job.  If it was simply single-payer pay for your insurance thru wage tax deduction then you wouldn't have to worry about that at all.

Medicare covers a huge amount of health care already because older people consume such a large part of health care.  Why not just extend that to everyone.  Employers could pay their employees so much more, build their businesses, invest, etc. if they didn't need to worry about health care and health insurance expenses.  Makes all the sense in the world.  The hodgepodge we have now is not very good.
 
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Posted: #64

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:

First off you can eat all the perfect foods you want and still get sick with problems when you age.

do you have evidence of this?

If you expand the timeline long enough, the life expectancy for everyone is zero.

 
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Posted: #65
Quote Originally Posted by TRAIN69:

If you expand the timeline long enough, the life expectancy for everyone is zero.



thats not a health problem. thats the final solution
 
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Posted: #66

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:


I think that is my major gripe. Paying 6k per year (and the 5-10% annual increases) might make sense if health insurance was a lifetime plan. However, i know once i'm divorced form my current job, every dollar i've ever spent on health care vanishes into thin air. And i think that is evil

But this is a statement on the concept of insurance itself, not on the government's involvement or lack thereof with it.

I think most people would be in complete agreement with your statement..just another reason why we need a major overhaul from the current system, which does exactly as you stated above.

 
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Posted: #67
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:

But this is a statement on the concept of insurance itself, not on the government's involvement or lack thereof with it.

I think most people would be in complete agreement with your statement..just another reason why we need a major overhaul from the current system, which does exactly as you stated above.



Insurance - risk pooling, in case you need it

health care - everyone agrees, everyone needs it at some point

current system of insurance for health care- obfuscate costs as much as possible, throw in all the government regulations and current gov't systems of giving people gov paid health care mixed in with the gov being a major pain in the dick when billed for payments

obama care as a solution - fascism in it's purist form , force people to purchase private health insurance, claim that somehow forcing those private insurers to cover everyone that they wouldn't cover before, because they deem them too expensive/least profitable (pre-existing), and forcing all americans to privately fund the private health insurance, will magically make health care more affordable. and i assume, they also claim it will make americans of better health. still don't see how it accomplishes any of their stated desired goals,,,,,,
 
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Posted: #68

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



Insurance - risk pooling, in case you need it

health care - everyone agrees, everyone needs it at some point

current system of insurance for health care- obfuscate costs as much as possible, throw in all the government regulations and current gov't systems of giving people gov paid health care mixed in with the gov being a major pain in the dick when billed for payments

obama care as a solution - fascism in it's purist form , force people to purchase private health insurance, claim that somehow forcing those private insurers to cover everyone that they wouldn't cover before, because they deem them too expensive/least profitable (pre-existing), and forcing all americans to privately fund the private health insurance, will magically make health care more affordable. and i assume, they also claim it will make americans of better health. still don't see how it accomplishes any of their stated desired goals,,,,,,

I think it only accomplishes one goal; reducing the factor which is the basis for the exorbitant costs of health care re: unpaid for medical costs.

 
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Posted: #69
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:

I think it only accomplishes one goal; reducing the factor which is the basis for the exorbitant costs of health care re: unpaid for medical costs.



i know this is gonna come off as me sounding like a dick, but whatever. do you have any data to prove this assertion? AFAICT, the reason health care is so expensive comes from multiple factors, the one you claim being the basis, imo, matters the least

It seems to me that aside from how unhealthy of an environment that the government has made for the citizenry, that the only reason that health care is so expensive, is because of end of life care. not just for the old, for everyone. If we spend over 4/5ths of total health care dollars on the last 3-6 months of people lives, it stands to reason, for me at least, that without altering something about the way we view the last 3 months of our lives,,,,nothing really changes

 
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Posted: #70

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:



i know this is gonna come off as me sounding like a dick, but whatever. do you have any data to prove this assertion? AFAICT, the reason health care is so expensive comes from multiple factors, the one you claim being the basis, imo, matters the least

It seems to me that aside from how unhealthy of an environment that the government has made for the citizenry, that the only reason that health care is so expensive, is because of end of life care. not just for the old, for everyone. If we spend over 4/5ths of total health care dollars on the last 3-6 months of people lives, it stands to reason, for me at least, that without altering something about the way we view the last 3 months of our lives,,,,nothing really changes

Well, we know that insurance operates at a low margin, and we further know that insurance is based on the actual cost of health services. So we need to look at the reasons for those costs.

I've said it before...if any business was forced to provide its services and incur over a 50% uncollectable cost for services it provides, how much are those actual costs going to be for people who pay?

I always get a little chuckle about the comment "the unhealthy environment that the government has made." I'm just not sure that role the government has in this athough if you want me to agree that the government should take a bigger role in health/safety of its citizenry, I wholeheartedly agree.

As for the last statement of yours, I am not sure how much of an impact that is. Most of the time, these are paid costs. If it is your argument that the correlation is medicare costs overruns, I can see that. But where is the line? And who decides?

 
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Posted: #71
I always get a little chuckle about the comment "the unhealthy environment that the government has made." I'm just not sure that role the government has in this athough if you want me to agree that the government should take a bigger role in health/safety of its citizenry, I wholeheartedly agree

-------------------------------
What is the purpose of the FDA and the food pyramid?


 
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Posted: #72
ever heard of medicare or medicaid?

link
 
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Posted: #73
balt/minny parlay pays 5/1 today,,,,,,just saying
 
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Posted: #74

FDA- I know your position is that the FDA is more or less, a joke. I guess my point is what are the solutions? Completely abolish it which leaves pretty much no regulations on food safety or increase its strength with greater regulations and a health/safety campaign?

 

Medicare/Medicaid- I don't disagree that it is an inane system. Again, though, I don't know how one drafts a solution to end of life medical decisions/costs.

 
 
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Posted: #75

Quote Originally Posted by be easy:

balt/minny parlay pays 5/1 today,,,,,,just saying

I'm gonna keep playing Twins team total unders the whole year.

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