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A Message to Users Contacting Local Bookies

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Posted: #26

LVTruck- Actually it's very practical. The reason the US pushes the rest of the world around is because other countries allow it. The US continues to be the bully on the block because other countries continue back down. The US government passed the UIGEA, which isn't worth the paper it's printed on, back in 2006. In 2007 several countries filed a complaint with the World Trade Organization over the fact that the US has no authority over offshore gaming companies located in sovereign territories. The World Trade Organization ruled against the United States in the matter.

The US government has chosen to ignore the ruling. So the US government is saying you have to follow what we say but we don't have to abide by a decision made by the World Trade Organization because we don't agree with it. This is a perfect example of why the events of 9-11 occured and why this country is hated by the rest of the world.

 
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Posted: #27

Quote Originally Posted by Edison5354:




I don't know about where you live at, but the casinos in my local area all work with local bookies.  Most of the card dealers have a local bookie to place bets with.  I know at least 5 card dealers that bet over their head and seek out some loan sharks, and is slowly paying off their debts.

Can't blame the bookies/loan sharks, the customers are the ones to be blamed.  They don't want to post up with a reputable online book because a lot of them are shot takers that'll only bet with a credit line.  You even see idiots on covers.com begging for a credit line here.  It's pretty common.  Most of these losers are shot taking stiffs that's unemployed and living in mommy and daddy's basement.  A lot of them think they can get away with running away after they lose a large amount of money.  But 95% of the time a bookies/loan sharks WILL find their asses and make them pay up in a timely fashion. 


 
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Posted: #28
Quote Originally Posted by lovesoccer:

LVTruck- Actually it's very practical. The reason the US pushes the rest of the world around is because other countries allow it. The US continues to be the bully on the block because other countries continue back down. The US government passed the UIGEA, which isn't worth the paper it's printed on, back in 2006. In 2007 several countries filed a complaint with the World Trade Organization over the fact that the US has no authority over offshore gaming companies located in sovereign territories. The World Trade Organization ruled against the United States in the matter.

The US government has chosen to ignore the ruling. So the US government is saying you have to follow what we say but we don't have to abide by a decision made by the World Trade Organization because we don't agree with it. This is a perfect example of why the events of 9-11 occured and why this country is hated by the rest of the world.

I just try to pick games, I pay if i'm Down, want to collect when i'm up. You a on a different  page then me,  You seem like a Cool Cat, I don't trip on the Government, for a lack of words  
 
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Posted: #29
lovesoccer,

Everyone agrees that the US is acting in contradiction to the WTO rulings, but as LVTruck indicates, you have be practical too.

Pinny and the rest of the "chickenshit" books that you mention are just companies, not countries.

They made a business decision to pull out of the American market because they knew that their government would not stick up for them if and when the Americans came after them.

And they were proven right.

So there are ideal situations and ideal expectations, but those always get crushed by reality, which is what led us at Covers to start this thread anyway.

As Lou said in that original message, we completely understand why people are turning to local bookies - but we need to remind y'all that local bookies are completely illegal and come with risks.

That's all.

As a company, it's one thing for us to advertise online sportsbooks that are operating legally in their jurisdictions, and it's something else completely for us to be condoning the use of illegal local bookies. That could put us in legal jeopardy.

Remember as well that 75% of the people on this site have probably never had to deal with a local bookie before, and has therefore never gambled on credit before either. That's a situation that could prove disastrous for a few people.

If somebody on this site hooks up with one of those bookies, and then eventually ends up owing them $50K and wakes up one morning to find all the windows in their car broken... well... we want to be certain that they are not going to turn around and blame us.

The world of local bookies is definitely different now than it was 20 years ago, but it sure as hell isn't as safe as the world of online bookmaking either.

So while we understand if people feel that American government is forcing them towards local bookies, we want those people to know that there are risks involved and that there are still a few operations out there that are willing to take their action.

And we still feel that as long as there are online books out there, they are still safer than the alternative.
 
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Posted: #30
 
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Posted: #31
i'm still convince i need a local from orange county. someone hook me up
 
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Posted: #32
 
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Posted: #33

hey lou,

why are you so quick to relate a local book with organized crime? Im not saying that there arent bookies that are involved in that life style bc trsut me there are, but not every bookie is affiliated with that kind of life,  any good book will run his operatiion like a business and be hoinest and fair with his players.  Just bc the local bookie doesnt have a license to be taking bets doesnt always make him a bad person or a gangster. Put that same guy in london and hes a well respected business man, but bc the govt says its illegal that makes him a member of organized crime?  its illegal to not wear your seatbelt while driving,  but that doesnt mean ur a bad guy if u dont

 
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Posted: #34
Quote Originally Posted by Lou:

Please read the following message from Covers.com:

It is opinion of Covers.com that online sports gambling is an activity that should be legalized and regulated in America as it is in most progressive first-world countries. Regulation would provide a path for Americans to safely wager online without being in contact with members of the criminal underworld. Revenues generated from licensing and regulation could be used for any number of positive social uses from paying down the deficit, to fighting poverty, to fighting addiction, to providing additional health care for the many former athletes who are suffering from debilitating health issues stemming from their careers.

It is our strong belief that sports gambling is an activity that will continue to thrive regardless of the laws imposed by any short-sighted politicians, as it has for decades. Countless studies have shown that Americans bet billions of dollars each year on sports, and the numbers continue to increase. In short, Americans are going to bet on sports, they are going to continue betting on sports, and the total amounts bet by Americans is going to continue growing.

The American government needs to decide whether it wants the dual benefit of collecting revenues while allowing honest American citizens to practice their hobby safely online with licensed and regulated companies, or whether it wants to instead force those citizens to begin dealing with unlicensed individuals who might also be associated with organized crime.

Currently, it appears the American government has made its choice and that is to side with the criminals.

Recent actions by the American government have made it exceedingly difficult for honest Americans to safely practice their hobby of sports betting online with licensed companies operating legally in regulated foreign jurisdictions. Therefore, many honest American citizens have been forced into the underground economy in order to simply continue practicing the otherwise harmless activity of wagering a few dollars on a sporting event. 

And one of the results is a large increase in the number of posts we see in this forum with people requesting contact with local bookies.

It is a sad state of affairs. Instead of safely placing money into a prepaid account with a licensed and regulated operation, American sports bettors must now seek out a local bookmaker and will likely also begin wagering on credit, which can easily start a pathway towards being a victim of extortion and loan-sharking.

Covers.com now finds itself between a rock and a hard place. Simple reality tells us that people are going to bet on sports and therefore need bookies. On the other hand, we certainly do not want any of our users finding themselves in any kind of danger that might arise from being in contact with criminals.

Therefore, we are going to be frequently encouraging our users to read the following information before posting any forum threads requesting contact with local bookies:

Bookmaking is an activity that is considered illegal by the American government, and therefore anybody seeking contact with a local bookmaker will almost certainly end up in contact with somebody who is breaking American laws.

Covers.com does not recommend that any of our users participate in any illegal activity or maintain any contact with any individuals who operate or participate in any illegal activity. As a sports bettor, that's a surefire way to get yourself betting on credit, which can end up really badly for you if you get in over your head and find yourself owing money to a criminal organization.

We do not wish to see or hear any stories of our honest users getting entangled with organized crime and possibly ending up in any kind of trouble, legal or otherwise.

Likewise, we wouldn't recommend that any bookmakers reply to any requests for contact by any users of this forum. How do you know that these guys are not undercover cops? Sooner or later you will get entrapped by one of these guys and you'll end up going down and bringing a lot of your friends and associates with you. Is that a smart choice? Do you really need the business that bad? 

Therefore, Covers.com does not condone or recommend the use of this forum to facilitate the practice of initiating contact between our users and any bookmakers or agents operating illegally in the United States. Any posts requesting direct contact between users and local bookmakers will be locked and/or edited immediately, if not deleted outright.

Instead, we strongly encourage you to browse our Where To Play list, and investigate the companies listed that are still willing to do business with Americans. That being said, we understand that the American government is actively trying to limit your ability to gamble safely online and you might be feeling as if you have no alternative other than finding a local bookie. We just don't recommend it.

Sincerely,
Covers.com



Personally, I think your post is spot on with very few exceptions. Having said that a person would be foolish to use any online book at this time after seeing places like Poker Stars, Fult Tilt and now the best most reliable and REPUTABLE book out there, the greek, no longer doing business with American's.

In my opinion if you have money in a book you had better get it out while you can and look for a bookie. Our government is much more concerned with propaganda designed to get positive public opinion over what is actually best for it's citizens, thus the state of our economy as we still spend millions and billions on fighting integrity driven sports books that do not break your legs or even threaten your family when you go $10,000 in the hole, something not possible at a sports book.

Overall a very well thought out and accurrate post and I understand covers need to promote their current money makers as betED once was, but if you bet with books now, you most likely will have your funds frozen in the near future. It is crazy that a country that promotes it's main strength as freedom is anything but in so many area's
 
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Posted: #35
bp3959,

I know exactly what you are saying. For years before the Internet, I was lucky enough to have a bookie that was mostly independent and not really affiliated with any crime organizations.

Still, I didn't want to end up owing him any money, because that would have been unpleasant.

And that's the real problem we have with local bookies. It's not the fact they are considered criminals so much, but rather they operate on credit, which is how players get themselves into trouble.

If any local bookies operated post-up business, we wouldn't have much of a problem with it at all.

This has nothing to do with our list. Anybody can see that we don't even track the links on our American list anymore.

This is about two things:
1) Keeping our users out of trouble.
2) Keeping ourselves out of trouble from promoting illegal local bookies.

 
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Posted: #36

Hey guys, how about the other side of the coin, collecting winnings from your local? Years ago, I got stiffed by a local and was not able to collect my winnings while I have yet to be stiffed by an offshoe sports book (I was fortunate I didn't have a BetEd Account). Personally I have more confidence trying to collect winnings from a reputable offshore sports book who likely has greater reserves of money to offset bettor hot streaks than the local has. Let me put it to you another way: if I happened to hit on a big parlay that pays 10K, I'd feel a lot more nervous about the prospect of collecting that kind of money from a local than I would from a decent offshore book.

*****************************************************************************

   One other thing to keep in mind; if you have a dispute about a bet you made with an offshore book, you may be able to get help resolving the situation from officials at Covers, SBR, OSGA, etc. You won't have any chance getting help from these same officials resolving a dispute with a local.

 
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Posted: #37

Is this a prelude to a major catastrophe?

 

I’m getting the feeling the end is near.

 

I have (what is to me) a lot of money that just got transferred over from Bet Jam.

 

I don’t have to say to whom it was transferred, we already know.

 

I’ll bet there are a lot of people who are requesting payouts (cleaning out their accounts) and I’m not sure if this barrage will be honored.

 

I’m gonna try and get my money, and go back to the “old fashioned” way.

 

Never thought I’d see this day.

 
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Posted: #38
Well Lou said what had to be said cause he had to say it and with that said ---that's all i got to say 'bout that
 
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Posted: #39
Quote Originally Posted by Lou:


If any local bookies operated post-up business, we wouldn't have much of a problem with it at all.



There's actually a lot of local bookies that operate a post up shop.  They do it that way to filter out the possible stiffs.  A lot of people prefer post up because there won't be any problems of betting more than what they can afford.  It's pretty much like going to a casino, buying chips first before I play.

But if a credit shop local bookie has customers that bet over their heads and stiff, that's the bookie's fault too for not doing his homework.  Local bookies should always ask their clients for copies of their paychecks and bank statements so they can determine how much can that client realistically lose.  Give them a weekly credit that makes sense.  If someone makes $2500 a month, then don't give them more than $800 to $1000 a week. 

My 2 cent.


 
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Posted: #40
Quote Originally Posted by rarejerbear:

Hey guys, how about the other side of the coin, collecting winnings from your local? Years ago, I got stiffed by a local and was not able to collect my winnings while I have yet to be stiffed by an offshoe sports book (I was fortunate I didn't have a BetEd Account). Personally I have more confidence trying to collect winnings from a reputable offshore sports book who likely has greater reserves of money to offset bettor hot streaks than the local has. Let me put it to you another way: if I happened to hit on a big parlay that pays 10K, I'd feel a lot more nervous about the prospect of collecting that kind of money from a local than I would from a decent offshore book.

*****************************************************************************

   One other thing to keep in mind; if you have a dispute about a bet you made with an offshore book, you may be able to get help resolving the situation from officials at Covers, SBR, OSGA, etc. You won't have any chance getting help from these same officials resolving a dispute with a local.



That's because you were playing with a local that's a wannabe bookie, not a real bookie.  Real local bookies that's been in this business for a long time will NEVER stiff their customers.


 
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Posted: #41

PPH shops are the best IMO

 
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Posted: #42

Well said Lou!

I said at the start of this that organized crime is going to take over, because people will not stop betting.  Now, organized crime may have been behind some books.  Now they'll be out in the open.

Whoever enforces this stuff disgusts me to no end.  I'm sure their excuse is "we just enforce the laws."  As long as they don't end up in jail, or owing $50K in credit to a local bookie, they're golden in their own d*mn eyes.

 
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Posted: #43
Quote Originally Posted by budwiser:

Well said Lou!

I said at the start of this that organized crime is going to take over, because people will not stop betting.  Now, organized crime may have been behind some books.  Now they'll be out in the open.

Whoever enforces this stuff disgusts me to no end.  I'm sure their excuse is "we just enforce the laws."  As long as they don't end up in jail, or owing $50K in credit to a local bookie, they're golden in their own d*mn eyes.



No local bookies would be dumb enough to give $50,000 weekly credit limit to anyone unless they are super rich.  And obviously they must look at each client's copy of paychecks and bank statement.  If a bookie don't do a check up on their clients like this, then they're stupid.
 
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Posted: #44

Quote Originally Posted by Edison5354:



No local bookies would be dumb enough to give $50,000 weekly credit limit to anyone unless they are super rich.  And obviously they must look at each client's copy of paychecks and bank statement.  If a bookie don't do a check up on their clients like this, then they're stupid.

Once they realize they're a square they get the bets and bet against the pick. The pros have a clue who's going to win.

They then go after the guy at the point where they can get his house or car or something extremely valuable.  Of course if he doesn't pay up....

It goes back to the old days.....

 
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Posted: #45
I have been stiff buy want2bee bookie before. that why i love post up books or offshore. betting can get you in trouble like Kenneth Weitzner (AKA The Shrink) 
 
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Posted: #46

Well Lou and all others ! YOU may not know this but guees what THE sports betting system is programmed into YOUR states lottery system!

NO BS i'm not joking !  ALL WE have to do is send E mails to US govs state reps congress men and the pres. at white house site to make sports betting legal in all US states !

This would benefit the whole country every year Trillions of dollars could be poored into the USA economy creat 100's of millions of NEW jobs !

of Course the Govt must impose strict rules and Laws after doing this !

LIKE NO CC wagers must be cash !

NO limits on any one !

HEY if YOU got 10,000 to bet on a game HELL yeah the country will take that wager hoping you lose !

URL for all states govs Reps and congressmen  E mail adresses n phone numbers
https://www.conservativeusa.org/mega-cong.htm

 

 
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Posted: #47

LISTEN TO THE ARTICLE & THESE FACTS!!!!!

Take it from a veteran who got  caught up in fbi investigation in 70's. Talkin naive, young high roller same good "good ole boys" that were taking action up  to 3/4 dimes a game from me ended up also being same guys dealing cocaine etc. etc.   Beating  someone making 100K+ in 70's while in his 20's wasn't hard.  All it did was destroy business pursuits, marriage, friendships an a life it took 15 years to get straightend out.  They really love you for sure!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Gambling credit is death my friends. Never used line of credit in casino's, but couldn't leave sports bedtting with credit alone. Talking hundreds of thousands when it was real money, but so it goes the lessons of life.  Stopped the gamblin, drinkin for 15 years, got it all straight in my head an finally now regular winner.

LISTEN WELL to advice in this article. Better off with online books, taking chances of not getting paid that having "officials" of the law or some guy calling your house making sure you can pay when you're 8-10K stuck, then having next level "freeze" your account.  Simple maneuver, when one guy can't pay you, next level person steps in says "tell you what if you lose we'll just knock it off what he owes you, but go ahead an pay you when you win".  DUUUUUH all sounded good when a kid an thought could beat it for sure when had em down 45K in couple of weeks. Course blew it back an another 10-15K, then feds show up since they had big guys phone hot who was tied in with Marcello's bunch in new orelans. When they play your recording when you were up 45K an question is what going to do about paying him. Answer being could put him box an put it 6 ft under. YOU WLL BEGIN TO PAY ATTENTION.  All the questions, the grand jury, the publicity etc. not worth it gentleman.  Take your shots with online books an enjoy it whether you are addicted, a real handicapper or real player.

 

When you post or hand it too the guy behind the window you will pay more attention an do better job.  Luckily, now kickin back on mailbox money, enjoying life, sports betting only during foots an sweet sixteen on bball.

Still comped nicely in casinos for solid craps action on numbers across the top, hedged with the don't.  Make few dollars here an there during foots. REMEMBER gentlemen, the gamble always has hustle an hustlers around it everywhere on the edges, in the middle lookin for the soft touch. 

HEED ADVICE USE ONLINE BOOKS

 
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Posted: #48
Quote Originally Posted by Edison5354:



There's actually a lot of local bookies that operate a post up shop.  They do it that way to filter out the possible stiffs.  A lot of people prefer post up because there won't be any problems of betting more than what they can afford.  It's pretty much like going to a casino, buying chips first before I play.

But if a credit shop local bookie has customers that bet over their heads and stiff, that's the bookie's fault too for not doing his homework.  Local bookies should always ask their clients for copies of their paychecks and bank statements so they can determine how much can that client realistically lose.  Give them a weekly credit that makes sense.  If someone makes $2500 a month, then don't give them more than $800 to $1000 a week. 

My 2 cent.              Edison , every post you mention the word stiff. speak for yourself and not what you think other ppl are. and no local bookie every asks for pay stubs or bank statements that by far one of the most dumbest things I have ever heard. man, i can picture now a bookie shaking someone down for pay stubs and bank statements. wtf is wrong with you? lol no even some offshore books ask for that much your local book is based on rep and connections not a shake down of paper work... watch out now if you dont pay him on time hes got your bank statement and your last employers address. wtf is he going to do with all that garbage. yea my bookie turned me down because my credit score wasnt high enough. he said i need to improve my fico score first.


 
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Posted: #49

Quote Originally Posted by jumba13462:

i'm still convince i need a local from orange county. someone hook me up

sure has been a horrible fishing season here in the OC, was wondering if the FB season would be any better, only thing is I have no local. any ideas?

 
 
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Posted: #50
I correctly called the end of online sports gambling in the United States when they first started talking about capital flight controls all the way back in 2007. The domino theory has played out, once neteller was shutdown and pinnacle banned United States residents the rest as they say was history.

Are you eating your humble fuckin' pie yet Vanzack?

Fuckin' douche bag.


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