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15 bucks to flip burgers in Seattle. Wow

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Posted: #51
BSW- I'm not sure what 5 guys pays, but In N out pays their employees more then min wage. That's by choice, not becasue the gov't told them to do so. If fast food wants to pay their employees more they should. Paying min wage shows they don't care about their employees so why should the employees care about their employer? It's a choice both parties make. If the fast food worker wants more, go find a different job where the owner actually cares about you. You get paid lower wages becasue you are replaceable.
Maybe those cooks will get recruited by higher quality restaurants and this 5 guys job is a stepping stone to get kitchen experience. FYI cooking a burger isn't that hard to do. Once you do it for a day it's pretty damn easy.  I made pizzas as my first job and I was paid min wage. Working a Friday night with a full oven and more waiting to get in was hard. But i didn't complain and over time I would ask for a raise. The owner cared about us so he gave them, by his choice to keep us happy and the customers. It's only strsssful for a few hours, that's a small portion of the work day. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen!
 
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Posted: #52
Quote Originally Posted by thorpe:


So your plan is to move all the McDonalds in Seattle somewhere where it is cheap to live?    

No silly.  Let the kids work. The adults need move somewhere their money will buy more.  Isn't this obvious to you?   


 
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Posted: #53
I work in employment and I can't fill a BASIC assembly job (hand assembly...verifying parts from a production router.....BASIC hand tools) for $12/hr.  That is not enough.  People laugh at you. And employers just piss and moan because they can never keep someone in the job for any period of time.  

Also, don't forget that you have to sometimes pay some people more to keep them doing a job that isn't exactly super enjoyable.  

And stop with all the business owners making money.  They took the risk.  If you could figure out a way to make a business work, then you could decide who makes what.  

That said, executive comp. has gotten out of control in many instances.  But they do it because they can.  

I mean gas went through the roof....did the trucking industry die? How 'bout the airline industry?  

I just tend to take a skeptic look at these things when people start talking about end of the world.  

We have a pretty remarkable way of adjusting when you think about it.  Not saying folks don't lose jobs and many can't afford the basics, but this has been going on forever, folks.  
 
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Posted: #54
Not to mention, every city has different demographics.  I worked with many far eastern folks back in the day and they would sometimes have aunts and uncles or even other families living with them to control costs.  Just different cultures.  But everywhere is different.  
 
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Posted: #55
Quote Originally Posted by thorpe:


So your plan is to move all the McDonalds in Seattle somewhere where it is cheap to live?    

You also bring up a good point.  If you were poor why would you live in a city like San Francisco?   Shouldn't you live where other people of the same class live where they are doing quite well.  Why would u live somewhere even if it was a higher minimum wage when you can't really afford living there.  Isn't that the reason why people move to other states like Arizona or Texas.  
 
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Posted: #56
Quote Originally Posted by bristolbob:



The girl deserves a raise by the way. If I read that correctly, she is 'opening and closing' the store for minimum wage. Domino's has given her additional responsibilities (management responsibilities - like cash accountability and bank deposits) and pocketed the savings (why hire an Assistant Manager when we can screw this girl over) I'm not saying $15 is the right number but someone with the keys to the building, access to the safe, etc shouldn't be making less than $10 an hour.


Yes you read it right. I don't remember the article saying anything about her handling any managerial duties besides sometimes opening and closing the store (I'm sure the store manager handles all the accouting and important things) but that's really all elementary in the grand scheme of things.

What you are forgetting is that she is working in a high volume low margin industry that is largely high in employee turnover (and for good reason BTW). Let's be clear....DOMINOS DOES NOT CARE ABOUT YOU. They have zero and I mean absolutely zero incentive to raise your wages when you can be replaced in minutes. The key is go get a job where there is room for growth or has a special skill and Domino's is neither.

I know the logical and fair side of you is saying "well this girl sacrificed herself for the betterment of the company so she should get a raise after 5 years" but that is not real life. You have zero bargaining power as an unskilled worker plain and simple and that's just how it goes.

Higher education is key people.
 
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Posted: #57
Quote Originally Posted by VegasVandal:



Yes you read it right. I don't remember the article saying anything about her handling any managerial duties besides sometimes opening and closing the store (I'm sure the store manager handles all the accouting and important things) but that's really all elementary in the grand scheme of things.

What you are forgetting is that she is working in a high volume low margin industry that is largely high in employee turnover (and for good reason BTW). Let's be clear....DOMINOS DOES NOT CARE ABOUT YOU. They have zero and I mean absolutely zero incentive to raise your wages when you can be replaced in minutes. The key is go get a job where there is room for growth or has a special skill and Domino's is neither.

I know the logical and fair side of you is saying "well this girl sacrificed herself for the betterment of the company so she should get a raise after 5 years" but that is not real life. You have zero bargaining power as an unskilled worker plain and simple and that's just how it goes.

Higher education is key people.

There definitely is something to it.  When I worked at a medical device firm, we had a job that in a sense involved putting a condom (actually a mail external catheter) on a mandrel (penis shaped rod). Just one after one ALL DAY long.  You'd just grab it, slide it on, and then do the next one. 

We had a wage scale and once you go to the top, that was it ($10 or $10.50 at the time).  You just can't get any better at a job like that.  They were lucky they started at $7.50 at the time.  

Funny thing is, it was a pretty easy job to fill.  Workers just put on tunes and let their minds wander.  We had good retention in this jobs...pretty amazing.  

I did it for an hour just to get a feel for it (I was doing the staffing). I just about lost my mind.  
 
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Posted: #58
And the best way to describe the wage increases were retention increases, not merit increases.  As long as your performance as satisfactory, you got to go to the next level.  Raise amounts pre-determined.  
 
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Posted: #59
It will only hurt the low wager earners, because.......wait for it......

There will be massive cutbacks and layoffs. Also you will see most of the burger order takers replaced by automation. You will go up to a computer screen and input your own order.   That's the way Sheets convenience stores are set up on the East Coast.  Go to a touch screen, place your order and enjoy. 
 
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Posted: #60
Quote Originally Posted by HutchEmAll:

I work in employment and I can't fill a BASIC assembly job (hand assembly...verifying parts from a production router.....BASIC hand tools) for $12/hr.  That is not enough.  People laugh at you. And employers just piss and moan because they can never keep someone in the job for any period of time.  



When I first read this I thought, well hell....I imagine it's pretty tough now to find someone that can program in assembly. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Basic_assembly_language_and_successors
 
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Posted: #61
Quote Originally Posted by Lippsman:

It will only hurt the low wager earners, because.......wait for it......

There will be massive cutbacks and layoffs. Also you will see most of the burger order takers replaced by automation. You will go up to a computer screen and input your own order.   That's the way Sheets convenience stores are set up on the East Coast.  Go to a touch screen, place your order and enjoy. 

I been waiting for that cool touchscreen order taking machine at drive thrus for years.  This might just accellerate it.    

Whoever can come up with a protection device for it will make millions.
 
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Posted: #62
Quote Originally Posted by MaineRoad:

It's illustrative that this occurred within a week of the announcement that the American economy actually contracted during the last quarter, and on the heels of the the proposed, job-annihilating EPA rules.

So, we have measures at the macro level that are designed (or might as well be designed) to kill real, family-sustaining jobs, both winthin the industry at which they are aimed,as well as those who will be impacted by the rise in energy prices, while, at the micro level we see fools of the same political stripe trying to invent jobs that don't (and can't) actually exist - in this case, the $15/hour Arby's counter job.  If it weren't so tragic, and if the impacts on people's lives so real, it would be funny. 



Your posts and BIG GAME's are very spot on..
 
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Posted: #63
Quote Originally Posted by Lippsman:

It will only hurt the low wager earners, because.......wait for it......

There will be massive cutbacks and layoffs. Also you will see most of the burger order takers replaced by automation. You will go up to a computer screen and input your own order.   That's the way Sheets convenience stores are set up on the East Coast.  Go to a touch screen, place your order and enjoy. 

 This is the future.....all payments by EBT cards (oops .. meant credit cards) 
 
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Posted: #64

Quote Originally Posted by redg:

San Francisco is having problems hiring traditionally lower paying jobs like line cooks right now because it's impossible to live there, or even most places within a reasonable commute distance on even 10 bucks an hour. Unemployment is 4.8%.

So?  Don't live on 10 bucks then--Those jobs are for kids and students, etc. Part-time and extra income folks.  If you are trying to live on 10 bucks---move somewhere else to do it!  Or learn a higher paying skill.

 
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Posted: #65
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

Cost of living is very high in some areas of the country, Seattle is one of them.

How can someone live in Seattle making 9 bucks an hour and have any hope of a life?

Other areas of the country also have higher wages for FF, and some places in lower general min wage also have higher wages..say like an airport for obvious reasons.

So?  Don't live on 10 bucks then--Those jobs are for kids and students, etc. Part-time and extra income folks.  If you are trying to live on 10 bucks---move somewhere else to do it!  Or learn a higher paying skill.

 
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Posted: #66

Quote Originally Posted by redg:

Minimum wage was originally intended to keep families at or above the poverty line
In 1968, the minimum wage was high enough for a family of three to be above the poverty line with the earnings of a full-time minimum-wage worker. Today, at the federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour, working 40 hours per week, 52 weeks per year yields an annual income of only $15,080.

During this time period how much has CEO compensation increased?

From 1978 to 2012, CEO compensation measured with options realized increased about 875 percent, a rise more than double stock market growth and substantially greater than the painfully slow 5.4 percent growth in a typical worker’s compensation over the same period.

So what?  If it is supply and demand and they are not stealing or cheating to do it and the companies are willing to pay the CEOs---let them be.

The two have nothing to do with each other really.  Some people are very ambitious and skilled---some are content to barely eke out a living---your choice by and large.

Don't like Min Wage---go to school and learn to be an executive---it pays a lot more for a lot more stress---your choice!  

 
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Posted: #67

Quote Originally Posted by SALTY:

I always hear about "Well what would the price of a hamburger cost if they raised minimum wage?"
Keep in mind the person always saying that was born with a silver spoon in their mouth or was handed a job through family or a friend. They tend to have the most to say about things they know nothing about from their own experiences.

I have said to them for many......Their $7.25 hr wont buy a hamburger at many places. And combos.....fagettaboutit!
Burgers used to cost a nickel(news flash!!!)

Of course the people weren't born with a sliver spoon or given jobs---very few really are---that is just being cynical.

Hamburger could still be a nickel---quit raising minimum wage!  haha!

 
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Posted: #68
The way I look at it- most businesses have a fairly set amount per hour total they can pay their employees-
Assuming sales remain constant, then their personnel costs must as well-

So in this scenario- 9 $10/hr employees will be cut to 6 $15/hr employees-in order to maintain the same profit margin-

The variables are will sales increase or will prices go up- because to keep all 9 at the new rate of $15/hr- another $45/hr must be made up somewhere-

That's just using numbers off the top of my head-but IMO it's the reality of these types of businesses-
None of their employees are skilled at a level to individually generate more revenue-
 
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Posted: #69

Quote Originally Posted by bristolbob:



The girl deserves a raise by the way. If I read that correctly, she is 'opening and closing' the store for minimum wage. Domino's has given her additional responsibilities (management responsibilities - like cash accountability and bank deposits) and pocketed the savings (why hire an Assistant Manager when we can screw this girl over) I'm not saying $15 is the right number but someone with the keys to the building, access to the safe, etc shouldn't be making less than $10 an hour.

Why?  People all of a sudden more honest or harder working when they make 10?  Of course she thinks she needs raise---they do not.  Supply and demand again--She should supply herself with another job---then she has leverage to negotiate.  If they cannot find someone else to do her job for that price; they will pay more.

 
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Posted: #70
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:


You have not worked in the industry to make a comment like this.

Even making 15 bucks an hour a FF job stinks..it is high stress, greasy, gross, lots of pressure.

This discussion is funny, every time some serf wage issue comes up the business fanatics think it will drive companies out of business when that never happens.

What happens is the workers that stay will end up having to work harder, prices will rise and profit margins will consolidate..which means the portion sizes will also decrease, food quality will probably suffer a little..but there wont be a catastrophe that some are suggesting.

On a different note when I was on my way to the local grocery store I saw a BIG banner from the local Jack in the Box proclaiming that they NOW ACCEPT EBT payments.

That is a much bigger issue than paying an over worked FF slave a reasonable wage.

You know he hasn't worked FF?  lotta people have...didn't stay but they did at one time. 

Yes---either businesses will leave or go out of business---or raise prices, etc.  then everything goes up...including skilled labor wages.  The 15 is the new 7.25.  Still have the same unskilled jobs at the bottom--these jobs are not to make a living on!  If you are trying to raise a family on min wage---you should get ambitious---got to scholl, learn another trade, or BE THE FF MANAGER!

 
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Posted: #71
Quote Originally Posted by BWS77:


Another ignorant comment.....  Have you ever dealt with customers while working in any kind of food industry?   Having 50 people in line at noon who expect to get served immediately because they only have a 30-minute lunch?  People that can't make up their mind?  People that ask "What do you have?  Is that any good?".  People that let their little kids order?  People that complain about everything?  People that hold up lines counting out exact change or searching for coupons?  Have you ever watched any Youtube video of fast food brawls?   

Trust me on this---pressure to make a burger for someone or lose your $15 hr job is a wee bit different than the pressure the 300K a year guy has when his job is at stake on a crucial deadline.

 
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Posted: #72
Quote Originally Posted by Lippsman:

It will only hurt the low wager earners, because.......wait for it......

There will be massive cutbacks and layoffs. Also you will see most of the burger order takers replaced by automation. You will go up to a computer screen and input your own order.   That's the way Sheets convenience stores are set up on the East Coast.  Go to a touch screen, place your order and enjoy. 

Yeah we had this discussion in another thread I think in politics and like Sheets or Wawa etc it wont happen at a FF place, the menu is too complex and the number of people needing service is much higher.

Burger King tried touch screen kiosks I think in the 80's, it failed. People are not smart enough to efficiently order via kiosk..you have to educate people to use it, an employee has to man it just like at the self serve grocery kiosks, the profit margin slips because there is no upsell..cash has to be handled which means someone has to give change...the cost to implement is too high and maintenance is high..the benefit is way too low to use these kinds of machines for ordering.
 
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Posted: #73
Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

You know he hasn't worked FF?  lotta people have...didn't stay but they did at one time. 

Yes---either businesses will leave or go out of business---or raise prices, etc.  then everything goes up...including skilled labor wages.  The 15 is the new 7.25.  Still have the same unskilled jobs at the bottom--these jobs are not to make a living on!  If you are trying to raise a family on min wage---you should get ambitious---got to scholl, learn another trade, or BE THE FF MANAGER!


Go interview how much the FF manager makes, I think you would be surprised. In many shops the higher earning line employee makes more per hour than the manager because the manager is salaried and works 50-60 hrs a week.

The comment I made is due to the flippant way he described doing a fast food job..like it is sleeping or something. If you have worked in FF then you know how draining it is, how gross it is and why most wont do it even if they are paid a decent wage. It is very high stress..
 
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Posted: #74
Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

Trust me on this---pressure to make a burger for someone or lose your $15 hr job is a wee bit different than the pressure the 300K a year guy has when his job is at stake on a crucial deadline.


Is it?   If the guy with a $300K/year job is smart he has a nest egg to fall back on and probably can get another high paying job.....  The burger guy probably needs his $15/hour A LOT more to survive than Mr.Fancy Job needs his $300K/year 
 
 
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Posted: #75
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:


Go interview how much the FF manager makes, I think you would be surprised. In many shops the higher earning line employee makes more per hour than the manager because the manager is salaried and works 50-60 hrs a week.

The comment I made is due to the flippant way he described doing a fast food job..like it is sleeping or something. If you have worked in FF then you know how draining it is, how gross it is and why most wont do it even if they are paid a decent wage. It is very high stress..

The U.S. national average salary for a fast food manager at a single location is $48,878, according to CBSalary, Career Builder's salary calculator

 
Way better than min wage.  Gotcha on the stress thing.  But it is all relative--FF not close to some other jobs, especially when worried about losing a high paying job.  But yes FF has stress.  But you could argue less stress than not having a job at all.  So very relative. 
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