The situation you are playing out tells me this guy has a pocket pair either kings or aces and want to protect his hand from losing to a flush draw so he goes all in...He might even have a king or ace of Diamonds to help him out some....I don't see anything wrong with calling preflop with what you had and you have to call the all in you have a ton of outs....But I don't know what kind of players they people are so he could be going all in with a higher flush draw or something like Ace 4....But you have to call the all in
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The situation you are playing out tells me this guy has a pocket pair either kings or aces and want to protect his hand from losing to a flush draw so he goes all in...He might even have a king or ace of Diamonds to help him out some....I don't see anything wrong with calling preflop with what you had and you have to call the all in you have a ton of outs....But I don't know what kind of players they people are so he could be going all in with a higher flush draw or something like Ace 4....But you have to call the all in
turn was a diamond so i made my flush, but i had a ton of outs(any d,Q or 7) and he had a 4 outer
he had bottom 2 pair and was in the blind. i put him on a better hand than i had but my outs were there and the money was right with his re-raise to call.
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exactly
turn was a diamond so i made my flush, but i had a ton of outs(any d,Q or 7) and he had a 4 outer
he had bottom 2 pair and was in the blind. i put him on a better hand than i had but my outs were there and the money was right with his re-raise to call.
the fact this is a 1-2 game is the only reason i would play a hand like this. if this was a 5-5 or a 5-10 game then no way would i play this hand pre-flop on a raise cause the raise would be in the 25/35 range. but in a 1-2 game a raise to only 6 is just a little sweetner.
i would rather play 5-5 or 5-10 NL to avoid taking beats you'd take in 1-2 on garbage hands. you don't see alot of loose calls with garbage hands when you raise the pot up in 5-5 5-10. if you're in a 1-2 and make a raise to 25 you will only get a call from high pockets QQ or better
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with what sm1tty said though
the fact this is a 1-2 game is the only reason i would play a hand like this. if this was a 5-5 or a 5-10 game then no way would i play this hand pre-flop on a raise cause the raise would be in the 25/35 range. but in a 1-2 game a raise to only 6 is just a little sweetner.
i would rather play 5-5 or 5-10 NL to avoid taking beats you'd take in 1-2 on garbage hands. you don't see alot of loose calls with garbage hands when you raise the pot up in 5-5 5-10. if you're in a 1-2 and make a raise to 25 you will only get a call from high pockets QQ or better
yup, he was in the blind, not sure small or big but nontheless he was in the blind. he even asked my why i made such a big raise from his 30 to my 130 and he was looking at me. i actually didnt want a call, i knew he had to have me beat at that point, but i had top pair with a ton of outs. my bet represented the best hand, i couldve had QQ, shit i couldve had Q2 or Q3 and had him dominated. if anything he shouldve just CALLED thats it, and then hope another diamond doesn't come on the turn. if he just called and no diamond on the turn then pushed all in then its a diff story with only one card to come. two pairs are very decieving, you have only 4 outs to even beat trips
later on i had AK off and looking at a raise to 12. i call and flop comes AK10. im like yeah top two, but the raiser goes all in for 103. i had to call and was looking at trip 10s. i mean i really didnt have to call but top 2 is very decieving and i had 4 outs or runner runner QJ for a split pot. AK two pair to me is alot harder to lay down compared to 2 3 two pair or even bottom two pair
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yup, he was in the blind, not sure small or big but nontheless he was in the blind. he even asked my why i made such a big raise from his 30 to my 130 and he was looking at me. i actually didnt want a call, i knew he had to have me beat at that point, but i had top pair with a ton of outs. my bet represented the best hand, i couldve had QQ, shit i couldve had Q2 or Q3 and had him dominated. if anything he shouldve just CALLED thats it, and then hope another diamond doesn't come on the turn. if he just called and no diamond on the turn then pushed all in then its a diff story with only one card to come. two pairs are very decieving, you have only 4 outs to even beat trips
later on i had AK off and looking at a raise to 12. i call and flop comes AK10. im like yeah top two, but the raiser goes all in for 103. i had to call and was looking at trip 10s. i mean i really didnt have to call but top 2 is very decieving and i had 4 outs or runner runner QJ for a split pot. AK two pair to me is alot harder to lay down compared to 2 3 two pair or even bottom two pair
Are you saying there were 6 players in the hand? If that's the case, you're certainly getting proper odds to see a flop. But that's the trouble with hands like that (not to mention the low limit games).....you end up sticking yourself in spots where you have to make further difficult decisions after the flop.
If I was going further with that hand, I would have called his bet on the flop and hoped to catch a diamond. I think it's a bad spot to semi-bluff with a shit diamond draw....especially after he led out on the flop like he did.....and by semi-bluffing there, you're basically committing to the hand.
His pre-flop raise was dumb with 2-3, but that's another story.
he even asked my why i made such a big raise from his 30 to my 130 and he was looking at me.
Very common with people who are on semi-bluffs...ESPECIALLY flush draws.
He had the right read IMO based on how he evaluated your play on the flop. You may have had the right odds to call after his re-raise (when you were on a draw), but it sounds like he thought he had the best hand......if that's the case, he played it correctly IMO by shoving in on the flop.
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Are you saying there were 6 players in the hand? If that's the case, you're certainly getting proper odds to see a flop. But that's the trouble with hands like that (not to mention the low limit games).....you end up sticking yourself in spots where you have to make further difficult decisions after the flop.
If I was going further with that hand, I would have called his bet on the flop and hoped to catch a diamond. I think it's a bad spot to semi-bluff with a shit diamond draw....especially after he led out on the flop like he did.....and by semi-bluffing there, you're basically committing to the hand.
His pre-flop raise was dumb with 2-3, but that's another story.
he even asked my why i made such a big raise from his 30 to my 130 and he was looking at me.
Very common with people who are on semi-bluffs...ESPECIALLY flush draws.
He had the right read IMO based on how he evaluated your play on the flop. You may have had the right odds to call after his re-raise (when you were on a draw), but it sounds like he thought he had the best hand......if that's the case, he played it correctly IMO by shoving in on the flop.
BTW, the SAME exact thing happened to a friend of mine last week. Was in a tournament and made a an all in stab at a pot with a board of A-8-2 (8 and 2 were diamonds....and he was borderline committed if he even played as it was late in the tournament.....two other guys were in pre-flop (one all in but he was a major shorty and no factor.....UTG just called the small all in and my buddy did as well). My buddy had K-10 of diamonds. Anyway, he shoves on a semi-bluff on the flop and the guy in cut off (who had originally called pre-flop) beat him into the pot with Q-Q. My buddy wanted to end the hand right there, but his big bet smelled to this other guy (if he had an ace, why not raise pre-flop and isolate the shorty who could have hand anything?).
I think pushing on flush draws has become so popular that people are starting to try and pick these people off more often.
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BTW, the SAME exact thing happened to a friend of mine last week. Was in a tournament and made a an all in stab at a pot with a board of A-8-2 (8 and 2 were diamonds....and he was borderline committed if he even played as it was late in the tournament.....two other guys were in pre-flop (one all in but he was a major shorty and no factor.....UTG just called the small all in and my buddy did as well). My buddy had K-10 of diamonds. Anyway, he shoves on a semi-bluff on the flop and the guy in cut off (who had originally called pre-flop) beat him into the pot with Q-Q. My buddy wanted to end the hand right there, but his big bet smelled to this other guy (if he had an ace, why not raise pre-flop and isolate the shorty who could have hand anything?).
I think pushing on flush draws has become so popular that people are starting to try and pick these people off more often.
i play with some people who like to play 2 3, they call it mississippi slick. of corse they wouldnt play it for 20 raise of 1-2 blinds but they would play it up to 7 or 8 raise.
i know this kid who pushed this hand, and he is a good player but i think he only called the raise to 6 was cause he was in the blind and it was cheap for him to see it, defending his blind so to say. you're right about just calling his 30 bet instead of re-raising, but i wanted him to think i had him beat and i wanted the pot. i felt like 100 was a good enough raise to throw him off his game a bit, make him think. it was the right move i guess by both of us. if i just call the 30 then my diamond hits the turn and he folds on any bet at all i make....even just 25. its a race 50/50. so i shouldve just called the 30....BUT he shouldve just called my 100 on top raise. for him to push like he did was a bad move by him, i wasn't just going to lay down and give him my 100
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hutch
i play with some people who like to play 2 3, they call it mississippi slick. of corse they wouldnt play it for 20 raise of 1-2 blinds but they would play it up to 7 or 8 raise.
i know this kid who pushed this hand, and he is a good player but i think he only called the raise to 6 was cause he was in the blind and it was cheap for him to see it, defending his blind so to say. you're right about just calling his 30 bet instead of re-raising, but i wanted him to think i had him beat and i wanted the pot. i felt like 100 was a good enough raise to throw him off his game a bit, make him think. it was the right move i guess by both of us. if i just call the 30 then my diamond hits the turn and he folds on any bet at all i make....even just 25. its a race 50/50. so i shouldve just called the 30....BUT he shouldve just called my 100 on top raise. for him to push like he did was a bad move by him, i wasn't just going to lay down and give him my 100
I don't think I'd play Q7 suited in any situation except one. If I'm in position and up against a weak player that I know I can steal the pot from. Would you make that same call with J4 suited?
I know you said he had 23 but with Q7 your were beat by every playing hand that made the flop. Q8-AQ, QQ, 23, 22, 33 plus any suited ace or king would have a better draw.
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I don't think I'd play Q7 suited in any situation except one. If I'm in position and up against a weak player that I know I can steal the pot from. Would you make that same call with J4 suited?
I know you said he had 23 but with Q7 your were beat by every playing hand that made the flop. Q8-AQ, QQ, 23, 22, 33 plus any suited ace or king would have a better draw.
you're right about just calling his 30 bet instead of re-raising, but i wanted him to think i had him beat and i wanted the pot. i felt like 100 was a good enough raise to throw him off his game a bit, make him think. it was the right move i guess by both of us. if i just call the 30 then my diamond hits the turn and he folds on any bet at all i make....even just 25. its a race 50/50. so i shouldve just called the 30....BUT he shouldve just called my 100 on top raise. for him to push like he did was a bad move by him, i wasn't just going to lay down and give him my 100
hmmm, where to start...first of all, i dont know why he would think that you have him beat. for him to think that he is beat you have to have, q2 or q3 and idk why you would be in with those hands. QQ, which is posssibly, but i dont expect that type of play from you based on the way you have posted that u play. 33 or 22 which would mean you have the case two 2s or case two 3s which is unlikely, not impossible, but i wouldnt fold there because i think thats what you had, or by the raise you made. So trying to make him think that you had him beat was pretty unlikely.
I definitly wouldve just called the 30 and seen the turn, raising the 100 marries you to the hand and not many hands are gonna give you action that cant beat queens with a 7 kicker.
If you just call the 30, then he isnt going to just auto fold if a diamond hits the turn, i know i wouldnt, just because someone calls a bet on the flop doesnt mean they have the draw that just hit. If you played it right then he probably wouldve still paid you off, maybe not double up, buy paid you off.
Finally, why should he have just called your 100 on top raise, he has about 1/3 of his chips in there already and i know if i was him id want to pushthe other 2/3 in when im most sure i have the best hand, not when abunch of scare cards come up
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you're right about just calling his 30 bet instead of re-raising, but i wanted him to think i had him beat and i wanted the pot. i felt like 100 was a good enough raise to throw him off his game a bit, make him think. it was the right move i guess by both of us. if i just call the 30 then my diamond hits the turn and he folds on any bet at all i make....even just 25. its a race 50/50. so i shouldve just called the 30....BUT he shouldve just called my 100 on top raise. for him to push like he did was a bad move by him, i wasn't just going to lay down and give him my 100
hmmm, where to start...first of all, i dont know why he would think that you have him beat. for him to think that he is beat you have to have, q2 or q3 and idk why you would be in with those hands. QQ, which is posssibly, but i dont expect that type of play from you based on the way you have posted that u play. 33 or 22 which would mean you have the case two 2s or case two 3s which is unlikely, not impossible, but i wouldnt fold there because i think thats what you had, or by the raise you made. So trying to make him think that you had him beat was pretty unlikely.
I definitly wouldve just called the 30 and seen the turn, raising the 100 marries you to the hand and not many hands are gonna give you action that cant beat queens with a 7 kicker.
If you just call the 30, then he isnt going to just auto fold if a diamond hits the turn, i know i wouldnt, just because someone calls a bet on the flop doesnt mean they have the draw that just hit. If you played it right then he probably wouldve still paid you off, maybe not double up, buy paid you off.
Finally, why should he have just called your 100 on top raise, he has about 1/3 of his chips in there already and i know if i was him id want to pushthe other 2/3 in when im most sure i have the best hand, not when abunch of scare cards come up
cause if he just called the 100 and then saw the turn, he'd be in better position to push if a diamond doesn't come on the turn, that is if he put me on a flush draw. that way he wouldn't bust out of the game or have to dig in his pocket for another buy. he would've saved himself 200 cause with the diamond that turned, oviously he would've checked and i would've made a value bet.
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cause if he just called the 100 and then saw the turn, he'd be in better position to push if a diamond doesn't come on the turn, that is if he put me on a flush draw. that way he wouldn't bust out of the game or have to dig in his pocket for another buy. he would've saved himself 200 cause with the diamond that turned, oviously he would've checked and i would've made a value bet.
cause if he just called the 100 and then saw the turn, he'd be in better position to push if a diamond doesn't come on the turn, that is if he put me on a flush draw.
If he puts you on a flush draw, he HAS to make it unattractive if possible for you to play the hand....not call and let you get another card knowing he's only playing the hand if a diamond DOESN'T come up. He can likely get all your chips in the pot on the flop.....you think you'd really call a huge bet by him (if a diamond does NOT come on the turn and he pushes) with one card to come on a crap diamond draw?
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cause if he just called the 100 and then saw the turn, he'd be in better position to push if a diamond doesn't come on the turn, that is if he put me on a flush draw.
If he puts you on a flush draw, he HAS to make it unattractive if possible for you to play the hand....not call and let you get another card knowing he's only playing the hand if a diamond DOESN'T come up. He can likely get all your chips in the pot on the flop.....you think you'd really call a huge bet by him (if a diamond does NOT come on the turn and he pushes) with one card to come on a crap diamond draw?
In my opinion the guy made the right call in going all in and protecting his hand...Bottom line it was a stupid hand for him to play and when you play cards like that, outcomes as these usually happen...He should have never called any raise with those two cards and he should blame himself for losing it was a bad move on his part....In that situation he had to move because I imagine he made the right read and made u pay handsomely to see another diamond turn up...But those cards should have been mucked in the first place...
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In my opinion the guy made the right call in going all in and protecting his hand...Bottom line it was a stupid hand for him to play and when you play cards like that, outcomes as these usually happen...He should have never called any raise with those two cards and he should blame himself for losing it was a bad move on his part....In that situation he had to move because I imagine he made the right read and made u pay handsomely to see another diamond turn up...But those cards should have been mucked in the first place...
The guy with 2-3 raised pre-flop and soup just called. So he never had to call a raise pre-flop (and I would agree, if he gets re-raised pre-flop, he just mucks). The question is, what is his play with bottom 2 pair facing the re-raise on the flop? As spoon said, the only hands that beat him are Q-3 and Q-2 (unlikely) and a set. Pretty small band of hands to think you're beat on the flop. Makes it easy to shove after the re-raise then.....%age wise, he made the right play (the guy with 2-3). But I agree with you...when you play these hands, you often run into tough decisions like this.
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davey-
The guy with 2-3 raised pre-flop and soup just called. So he never had to call a raise pre-flop (and I would agree, if he gets re-raised pre-flop, he just mucks). The question is, what is his play with bottom 2 pair facing the re-raise on the flop? As spoon said, the only hands that beat him are Q-3 and Q-2 (unlikely) and a set. Pretty small band of hands to think you're beat on the flop. Makes it easy to shove after the re-raise then.....%age wise, he made the right play (the guy with 2-3). But I agree with you...when you play these hands, you often run into tough decisions like this.
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