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Pastor Rick Warren: Son Committed Suicide With 'Unregistered Gun'

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Posted: #26
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Djbrow pretty much covered the extent to which your post is as silly as can be..

People can receive treatment for depression and should. Guns make suicide 100% effective... And because suicides lead gun-related deaths overwhelmingly, this country obviously isn't doing enough to help individuals. 

You on the other hand can't grasp such a basic idea that even canov understood..


Do you really think that Pastor Rick's son would have chosen not to commit suicide if he couldn't get his hands on a gun?
 
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Posted: #27
Why does it matter that the gun was not registered?
 
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Posted: #28
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Do you really think that Pastor Rick's son would have chosen not to commit suicide if he couldn't get his hands on a gun?


Well we will never be 100% certain but VAST literature on suicides determine that he would not have been able to as easily statistically speaking so......

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/us/to-lower-suicide-rates-new-focus-turns-to-guns.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/gun-ownership-and-use/

https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-publhealth-031811-124636?journalCode=publhealth

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/risk/

https://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/160/10/929.full
 
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Posted: #29
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Djbrow pretty much covered the extent to which your post is as silly as can be..

People can receive treatment for depression and should. Guns make suicide 100% effective... And because suicides lead gun-related deaths overwhelmingly, this country obviously isn't doing enough to help individuals. 

You on the other hand can't grasp such a basic idea that even canov understood..

Thanks for the compliment.

So watching FOX News and listening to Rush has made me smarter 

I'm playing with my Hannity action figure right now.
 
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Posted: #30
Kind of a typical liberal response to a problem.

Stop begging the government to protect us from ourselves.  
It will never end well.  

 
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Posted: #31
Quote Originally Posted by rick3117:

Kind of a typical liberal response to a problem.

Stop begging the government to protect us from ourselves.  
It will never end well.  


So you don't support cigarette laws, alcohol laws, any drug laws, any gun laws at all.

There really is no difference between you and bowlslit.
 
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Posted: #32
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Is it always a temporary problem?

Oh, I forgot, people that commit suicide can't spend money on depression meds.

Thats all we need, a run on kleenex tissue. Waaaaa.

This kind of response is what proves your lies. No one with kids would ever have such bravado regarding suicide, given the suicide rates among teens. 

 
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Posted: #33
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:


This kind of response is what proves your lies. No one with kids would ever have such bravado regarding suicide, given the suicide rates among teens. 



I don't have to worry about my boys. They are shy but have healthy self esteems and easily make quality friends.

I've always taught them to approach their problems head on and  that suicide is mostly for cowards.

PTSD is different. I think differently about that and its indirect effects.

 
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Posted: #34
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:


So you don't support cigarette laws, alcohol laws, any drug laws, any gun laws at all.

There really is no difference between you and bowlslit.


You can't go a whole day without using the broad brush can you?
 
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Posted: #35
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Well we will never be 100% certain but VAST literature on suicides determine that he would not have been able to as easily statistically speaking so......

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/us/to-lower-suicide-rates-new-focus-turns-to-guns.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/gun-ownership-and-use/

https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-publhealth-031811-124636?journalCode=publhealth

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/risk/

https://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/160/10/929.full


Thank you stiln for using stats. I'm curious, statistically speaking, what are the odds that an elementary school student will encounter a real shooting scenario in a given school year?

What about a high school student?
 
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Posted: #36

Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



I don't have to worry about my boys. They are shy but have healthy self esteems and easily make quality friends.



No one, and I mean, NO ONE, with real kids has this kind of bravado regarding the society where they are growing up.

The various pressures and situations create vulnerabilities in every child and any real parent knows this.

You just aren't believable.

 
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Posted: #37
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Thank you stiln for using stats. I'm curious, statistically speaking, what are the odds that an elementary school student will encounter a real shooting scenario in a given school year?

What about a high school student?


When you realize you're wrong you start deflecting this has been a pattern..

You're really a weirdo.. the fact that you would make up a lie about having kids..?
 
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Posted: #38
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:

No one, and I mean, NO ONE, with real kids has this kind of bravado regarding the society where they are growing up.

The various pressures and situations create vulnerabilities in every child and any real parent knows this.

You just aren't believable.



I could give two squirts of piss whether or not you and that little sissy believe me or not.

All suicide is sad, especially teen and military suicide. The fact is all other forms of suicide is cowardice and deserves little sympathy.

As I said, I have always taught my boys to face problems head on.

Teen suicide is sad because it usually involves a stupid parent. Military suicide is sad because it usually involves PTSD.


 
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Posted: #39
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



When you realize you're wrong you start deflecting this has been a pattern..

You're really a weirdo.. the fact that you would make up a lie about having kids..?


Actually, my pattern when I have been wrong is to own up to it. Just like when I was wrong about how many citizens per 100 owned guns. You, are the one who can't admit to being wrong, even to the very end.

For the record, I am not wrong, people that want to commit suicide are not deterred by not being able to obtain a gun.

Pills and ropes are far too easy to obtain.
 
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Posted: #40
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Actually, my pattern when I have been wrong is to own up to it. Just like when I was wrong about how many citizens per 100 owned guns. You, are the one who can't admit to being wrong, even to the very end.

For the record, I am not wrong, people that want to commit suicide are not deterred by not being able to obtain a gun.

Pills and ropes are far too easy to obtain.


Did you even read the links I posted....

Guns account for close to 90% of suicides in the US...

Other methods are extremely low less than 5%..

And the other methods success rate is less than 40% therefore the researchers determined that having a gun in the home even made people more suicidal..

Yeah of course if someone is absolutely determined to off themselves, they will find that way but a majority of people arent which is why treatment is so vital..and if a gun is around there is no chance for treatment obviously.

How is this so difficult for you to grasp.....?

Why do you keep fighting this...You're wrong again..

Me on the other hand, if I was wrong I would admit it however that's not the case little fella..
 
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Posted: #41
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:


So you don't support cigarette laws, alcohol laws, any drug laws, any gun laws at all.

There really is no difference between you and bowlslit.
You are turning into quite a reactionary. 

I support laws that deem an acceptable age to buy cigs, drink, etc.  
I think we are losing the war on drugs, and prohibition has lead to more deaths than Iraq, Afghanistan, Desert Storm, and Vietnam combined.  I am not for government handing out heroin to children, but I am for decriminalization and treating addiction as a disease/mental health problem, and not a crime, and for god's sake legalize weed.  who cares, the stuff is harmless. 

I wish we could have "common sense" gun laws, but you can not negotiate with people that want outright bans. I wish we could make training mandatory, gun safety classes mandatory, but to move forward with that agenda would only lead liberal minds to find a way to tax it, or roll it into some sort of registry.  


I feel like I have been pretty consistently for individual liberties, from everything from happy marriage to guns.  

I do not want to tell anyone how to live, or what they can and can't do.  I do not want to monitor people, and keep track of them.  I do not care what people do, sexually, financially, or otherwise.  

I want the maximum amount of freedom til we are at the edge of the cliff looking into the canyon of anarchy.  




 
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Posted: #42
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Did you even read the links I posted....

Guns account for close to 90% of suicides in the US...

Other methods are extremely low less than 5%..

And the other methods success rate is less than 40% therefore the researchers determined that having a gun in the home even made people more suicidal..

Yeah of course if someone is absolutely determined to off themselves, they will find that way but a majority of people arent which is why treatment is so vital..and if a gun is around there is no chance for treatment obviously.

How is this so difficult for you to grasp.....?

Why do you keep fighting this...You're wrong again..

Me on the other hand, if I was wrong I would admit it however that's not the case little fella..


Bull shlt!

The use of firearms in suicides ranges from less than 10% in Australia[20] to 53.7% in the U.S., where it has been the most common method of suicide.[21]

...Two separate studies, in Canada and Australia, conducted in conjunction with more restrictive firearms legislation, demonstrated that while legislation showed a decrease in firearms suicide, other methods such as hanging increased. In Australia, the overall rate of suicide continued along an increasing trend, not decreasing until measures specifically aimed to provide support for those intent on suicide were implemented.[29][30][31]

...Research also indicates no association vis-à-vis safe-storage laws of guns that are owned, and gun suicide rates; and studies that attempt to link gun ownership to likely victimology often fail to account for the presence of guns owned by other people.[32][33] Researchers have shown that safe-storage laws do not appear to affect gun suicide rates or juvenile accidental gun death.[32][33]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_methods


GSM
 
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Posted: #43
In some European countries with highly developed rail networks and strict gun control laws, such as Germany and Sweden, railway-related suicide is considered a social problem, and extensive research has been carried out into this type of suicide.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_methods

Guns would save the railroad conductors from PTSD
 
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Posted: #44
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Did you even read the links I posted....

Guns account for close to 90% of suicides in the US...

Other methods are extremely low less than 5%..

And the other methods success rate is less than 40% therefore the researchers determined that having a gun in the home even made people more suicidal..

Yeah of course if someone is absolutely determined to off themselves, they will find that way but a majority of people arent which is why treatment is so vital..and if a gun is around there is no chance for treatment obviously.

How is this so difficult for you to grasp.....?

Why do you keep fighting this...You're wrong again..

Me on the other hand, if I was wrong I would admit it however that's not the case little fella..




See post #42

Let it be known that you ran and hid like a bee och.
 
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Posted: #45
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Bull shlt!

The use of firearms in suicides ranges from less than 10% in Australia[20] to 53.7% in the U.S., where it has been the most common method of suicide.[21]

...Two separate studies, in Canada and Australia, conducted in conjunction with more restrictive firearms legislation, demonstrated that while legislation showed a decrease in firearms suicide, other methods such as hanging increased. In Australia, the overall rate of suicide continued along an increasing trend, not decreasing until measures specifically aimed to provide support for those intent on suicide were implemented.[29][30][31]

...Research also indicates no association vis-à-vis safe-storage laws of guns that are owned, and gun suicide rates; and studies that attempt to link gun ownership to likely victimology often fail to account for the presence of guns owned by other people.[32][33] Researchers have shown that safe-storage laws do not appear to affect gun suicide rates or juvenile accidental gun death.[32][33]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_methods


GSM


Stiln, waiting for you to admit you were wrong again!


 
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Posted: #46
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:



Stiln, waiting for you to admit you were wrong again!




Wasn't wrong on anything.... Your referenced wikipedia...

I reference a Harvard study

Keep digging you moron..
 
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Posted: #47
I await your apology.

Thanks in advance little fella!
 
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Posted: #48
Interesting:

Respondents with firearms in the home were no more likely to report suicidal thoughts, plans or attempts, but if they had a suicidal plan, it was much more likely to involve firearms. 

And:
The preponderance of current evidence indicates that gun availability is a risk factor for youth suicide in the United States.  The evidence that gun availability increases the suicide rates of adults is credible, but is currently less compelling. 

--All of that research is dated, by the way.
 
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Posted: #49
Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:



Did you even read the links I posted....

Guns account for close to 90% of suicides in the US...

Other methods are extremely low less than 5%..

And the other methods success rate is less than 40% therefore the researchers determined that having a gun in the home even made people more suicidal..

Yeah of course if someone is absolutely determined to off themselves, they will find that way but a majority of people arent which is why treatment is so vital..and if a gun is around there is no chance for treatment obviously.

How is this so difficult for you to grasp.....?

Why do you keep fighting this...You're wrong again..

Me on the other hand, if I was wrong I would admit it however that's not the case little fella..


12. The case-fatality rate for suicide attempts with guns is higher than other methods

Across the Northeast, case fatality rates ranged from over 90% for firearms to under 5% for drug overdoses, cutting and piercing (the most common methods of attempted suicide).  Hospital workers rarely see the type of suicide (firearm suicide) that is most likely to end in death.


I can understand how a feeble brain can misread this statement from YOUR Harvard site.

Again, your apology is anticipated feeble one.

 
 
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Posted: #50
I reference a Harvard study



Actually, it isn't a study. It is a meta-analysis.

Anyway, it says:


In addition, data from the National Comorbidity Study indicate that people living in homes with guns are about as likely as those living in homes without guns to suffer from depression, substance use problems, and suicidal thoughts
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