Figured its time hop online and start posting my picks. Im up $30,000 for the season and the folks around me say I need to get into handicapping.
Let me preface this by saying that unless you are Billy Walters or The Syndicate, 99% of you who bet on games straight up will lose. Between the vig eroding your winnings and the unpredictable nature of 19 year olds throwing a ball around, statistically speaking "the house always wins".
That said, there is an alternative approach that I have been refining over the years which has achieved remarkable results, and that is the game of longshot money line round robin parlays.
To put it plainly, money lines become relatively arbitrary when a team is an 8 point dog (+325-ish) and above. If you believe a team has a 20% chance of winning and is getting +900 on a ML, there is "value" there. In a multi team parlay, that value is assigned a multiplier. For instance, last night VMI was +2000 and Georgia Tech was +450. A $10 bet on those two teams would pay 114-1. Upsets like this happen more than you would think, and arguably all the time (just ask Duke how it feels). This strategy contends that systematically selecting (when available) the 3 or 4 best teams with the highest "value" in their moneyline odds, then round robin parlaying all 2,3,4 team combinations, that you will, over a season, extract more value than you ever could betting straight up. but you have to know which of the longshots to look for, and I believe, in the aggregate, I do.
I will be tracking these bets two ways... I will track performance against the spread (so if none of my four picks hit ML, but all hit spread, I would be 4-0 on the spread and 0-1 on the win). My record will be a "win" if 2 of the four teams hit. Note a 2 team parlay with the odds I'm betting results in an average 5x payout. So if I go 2-4 with an average $50 unit bet on a four team round robin (5 teams total, $550 per four team play) then I'm up thousands. If 3 of those teams hit any of the nights, I'd be up $20k. If a four teamer hit (admittedly I've only done once in my life) it could pay in excess of $100k. Hope this makes sense to everyone. So, without further ado, here is the write up for tonight. BOL to all.
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To remove first post, remove entire topic.
Figured its time hop online and start posting my picks. Im up $30,000 for the season and the folks around me say I need to get into handicapping.
Let me preface this by saying that unless you are Billy Walters or The Syndicate, 99% of you who bet on games straight up will lose. Between the vig eroding your winnings and the unpredictable nature of 19 year olds throwing a ball around, statistically speaking "the house always wins".
That said, there is an alternative approach that I have been refining over the years which has achieved remarkable results, and that is the game of longshot money line round robin parlays.
To put it plainly, money lines become relatively arbitrary when a team is an 8 point dog (+325-ish) and above. If you believe a team has a 20% chance of winning and is getting +900 on a ML, there is "value" there. In a multi team parlay, that value is assigned a multiplier. For instance, last night VMI was +2000 and Georgia Tech was +450. A $10 bet on those two teams would pay 114-1. Upsets like this happen more than you would think, and arguably all the time (just ask Duke how it feels). This strategy contends that systematically selecting (when available) the 3 or 4 best teams with the highest "value" in their moneyline odds, then round robin parlaying all 2,3,4 team combinations, that you will, over a season, extract more value than you ever could betting straight up. but you have to know which of the longshots to look for, and I believe, in the aggregate, I do.
I will be tracking these bets two ways... I will track performance against the spread (so if none of my four picks hit ML, but all hit spread, I would be 4-0 on the spread and 0-1 on the win). My record will be a "win" if 2 of the four teams hit. Note a 2 team parlay with the odds I'm betting results in an average 5x payout. So if I go 2-4 with an average $50 unit bet on a four team round robin (5 teams total, $550 per four team play) then I'm up thousands. If 3 of those teams hit any of the nights, I'd be up $20k. If a four teamer hit (admittedly I've only done once in my life) it could pay in excess of $100k. Hope this makes sense to everyone. So, without further ado, here is the write up for tonight. BOL to all.
1) Its in-conference rivalry season. When you're in the same conference (and to a degree, NCAA in general), it means, by default, there is parity. You recruit from the same pool, you play and learn against the same teams, and in a broad sense, you are considered peers. That's why its not a shock when just last night:
- VMI, a 20 point dog, beats Chatanooga by 16 - Boston College, a 16 point dog to Miami, loses by 1 - Georgia Tech, a 10 point dog, beats Florida State by 22. - And the night before, #1, #2, and #4 all lost
The overall intention with this betting strategy is to identify long shot games where there is a value at least 1.5x of what the ML provides, and if you identify 3 or more on the same night, to round robin picks, as ML parlays have mega returns.
2) These are college kids. Not precision machines... not NBA worthy athletes... just college kids. While Vegas tries their best, sometimes kids have off nights and huge lines just vanish.
3) The goal is to survive enough nights with 2 of 4 hitting to see a night where 3 of 4 hit. Those are $20k hits. If, and when, you land a 4 team night, that is worth $100k and you immediately stop what you doing, and buy hookers and blow.
Here are my picks for tonight:
UTSA (9-10) vs. Marshall (12-8) - 6:00pm +935 (+14.5)
Dunkel Index: +7, OddsShark: +2
These are two pretty bad teams with pretty similar records. Statistically speaking Marshall beats them in all categories except UTSA kills on the boards, ranking #16 in the nation (vs. #163 for Marshall). On January 7th, UTSA was a 17 point dog against Louisiana Tech and are winners of 6 of their last 8. 14.5 points is monumental spread for a hot team with proven recent big upset potential, so playing the value... plus the pick services are hot on UTSA.
Delaware (8-13) vs. William & Mary (9-9) - 6:00pm +668 (+12.5)
Again... two bad teams with similar records, so anything can happen. Just two games ago, Delaware was an 8.5 dog vs. Northeastern and won. They also tend not to perform well on the road, so that's a knock here. William & Mary are losers of last 3 of 4, with only win as 1 point while 7 point favorites. Least favorite play of picks, but too much value to turn down. If I were to sub a game from below, I'd swap Nebraska here... but still deciding.
Virginia Tech (15-4) vs. UNC (18-3) - 7:00pm +861 (+14)
Way too many points for a rivalry game, especially between two good teams. Think Vegas is over valuing UNC home court advantage. UNC lost to Georgia Tech by 12 and beat Clemson in OT, while VT beat both in regulation. There's parity here, and while UNC should be favored, I think the ML has lots of value. Sportsline has VT winning 20% of simulations, my gut says more line 25%, so the 9:1 ML odds are where its at.
U. San Fran (14-7) v. St. Mary (17-2) - 10:00pm +935 (+14.5)
Dunkel Index: +9
I've followed USF all season... watching them beat both Utah and Illinois State in the Hawaii Classic. When they're on, these guys are good. Like tourney good. Plus they have a guy on their team named Frankie Ferrari, so how can you not love that. USF had a tough in-state stretch against two ranked teams plus BYU and Santa Clara, losing all four with average loss of 12. One was tonight's rival St. Mary and by 11. But, they've won their last 3 in a row by an average of 20 points, and in the case they are on again, they will play St. Marys tough. Speaking of, St. Mary's just beat Pacific by 12 where SF just won by 21, and lost to Gonzaga by 23. Like the ML value... will all depend if USF comes to play.
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1) Its in-conference rivalry season. When you're in the same conference (and to a degree, NCAA in general), it means, by default, there is parity. You recruit from the same pool, you play and learn against the same teams, and in a broad sense, you are considered peers. That's why its not a shock when just last night:
- VMI, a 20 point dog, beats Chatanooga by 16 - Boston College, a 16 point dog to Miami, loses by 1 - Georgia Tech, a 10 point dog, beats Florida State by 22. - And the night before, #1, #2, and #4 all lost
The overall intention with this betting strategy is to identify long shot games where there is a value at least 1.5x of what the ML provides, and if you identify 3 or more on the same night, to round robin picks, as ML parlays have mega returns.
2) These are college kids. Not precision machines... not NBA worthy athletes... just college kids. While Vegas tries their best, sometimes kids have off nights and huge lines just vanish.
3) The goal is to survive enough nights with 2 of 4 hitting to see a night where 3 of 4 hit. Those are $20k hits. If, and when, you land a 4 team night, that is worth $100k and you immediately stop what you doing, and buy hookers and blow.
Here are my picks for tonight:
UTSA (9-10) vs. Marshall (12-8) - 6:00pm +935 (+14.5)
Dunkel Index: +7, OddsShark: +2
These are two pretty bad teams with pretty similar records. Statistically speaking Marshall beats them in all categories except UTSA kills on the boards, ranking #16 in the nation (vs. #163 for Marshall). On January 7th, UTSA was a 17 point dog against Louisiana Tech and are winners of 6 of their last 8. 14.5 points is monumental spread for a hot team with proven recent big upset potential, so playing the value... plus the pick services are hot on UTSA.
Delaware (8-13) vs. William & Mary (9-9) - 6:00pm +668 (+12.5)
Again... two bad teams with similar records, so anything can happen. Just two games ago, Delaware was an 8.5 dog vs. Northeastern and won. They also tend not to perform well on the road, so that's a knock here. William & Mary are losers of last 3 of 4, with only win as 1 point while 7 point favorites. Least favorite play of picks, but too much value to turn down. If I were to sub a game from below, I'd swap Nebraska here... but still deciding.
Virginia Tech (15-4) vs. UNC (18-3) - 7:00pm +861 (+14)
Way too many points for a rivalry game, especially between two good teams. Think Vegas is over valuing UNC home court advantage. UNC lost to Georgia Tech by 12 and beat Clemson in OT, while VT beat both in regulation. There's parity here, and while UNC should be favored, I think the ML has lots of value. Sportsline has VT winning 20% of simulations, my gut says more line 25%, so the 9:1 ML odds are where its at.
U. San Fran (14-7) v. St. Mary (17-2) - 10:00pm +935 (+14.5)
Dunkel Index: +9
I've followed USF all season... watching them beat both Utah and Illinois State in the Hawaii Classic. When they're on, these guys are good. Like tourney good. Plus they have a guy on their team named Frankie Ferrari, so how can you not love that. USF had a tough in-state stretch against two ranked teams plus BYU and Santa Clara, losing all four with average loss of 12. One was tonight's rival St. Mary and by 11. But, they've won their last 3 in a row by an average of 20 points, and in the case they are on again, they will play St. Marys tough. Speaking of, St. Mary's just beat Pacific by 12 where SF just won by 21, and lost to Gonzaga by 23. Like the ML value... will all depend if USF comes to play.
POTENTIAL ALTERNATE ROUND ROBIN I have my eyes on these four games separately. Wont waste time on write ups, but lots of upset potential. I'm going to do a separate, lower amount ($30 unit, $330 total) round robin the four teams below on a separate parlay vs. trying to weave them into the above. Of all the below, I like Eastern Kentucky the best.
Nebraska (+340, +8.5) v Northwestern - Dunkel Index: +2 (Pick of the Day)
Southeast Missouri St. (+340, +8.5) v Murray State - Dunkel Index: +6, OddsShark: +2
UTEP (+326, +8) v W. Kentucky - Dunkel Index: +5, OddsShark: Draw
Eastern Kentucky (+370, +9) v Jacksonville State - Dunkel Index: +4.5, OddsShark: +4
Here is what the 4 teamer should look like with the primary bet:
You should also have every 2 and 3 team combo in between. Will post picks for next week worth of games and we can all revisit then. Again, best of luck to all.
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POTENTIAL ALTERNATE ROUND ROBIN I have my eyes on these four games separately. Wont waste time on write ups, but lots of upset potential. I'm going to do a separate, lower amount ($30 unit, $330 total) round robin the four teams below on a separate parlay vs. trying to weave them into the above. Of all the below, I like Eastern Kentucky the best.
Nebraska (+340, +8.5) v Northwestern - Dunkel Index: +2 (Pick of the Day)
Southeast Missouri St. (+340, +8.5) v Murray State - Dunkel Index: +6, OddsShark: +2
UTEP (+326, +8) v W. Kentucky - Dunkel Index: +5, OddsShark: Draw
Eastern Kentucky (+370, +9) v Jacksonville State - Dunkel Index: +4.5, OddsShark: +4
Here is what the 4 teamer should look like with the primary bet:
You should also have every 2 and 3 team combo in between. Will post picks for next week worth of games and we can all revisit then. Again, best of luck to all.
The play is every 2,3 and 4 team combination of UTSA, Delaware, VT and USF money lines. There are 11 potential combinations, so pick a unit $ amount (say $50, which is what I'm playing) multiply that by 11, and that will be your total bet ($550 for the top one, $330 for the bottom in my case). Then hope at least 2 of the four teams win straight up. My experience shows me this will hit at a frequency of 1 in 3 or 4 nights which nets a healthy profit. If one of those nights three of the teams win, then party time for you.
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Quote Originally Posted by Rhdrake22:
so wheres the play??
The play is every 2,3 and 4 team combination of UTSA, Delaware, VT and USF money lines. There are 11 potential combinations, so pick a unit $ amount (say $50, which is what I'm playing) multiply that by 11, and that will be your total bet ($550 for the top one, $330 for the bottom in my case). Then hope at least 2 of the four teams win straight up. My experience shows me this will hit at a frequency of 1 in 3 or 4 nights which nets a healthy profit. If one of those nights three of the teams win, then party time for you.
If you have any doubts about the potential of the system, you can see here how the risk was minimal, and how we were ever so close to a multi thousand dollar payday. Tomorrow games are thin so will be back on Saturday with more. Onward and upward!
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So basically break even night. 0-4 on the $50 and 2-4 on the $30, for a 20-1 profit of $600, although loss of the $550. Proof here of win:
If you have any doubts about the potential of the system, you can see here how the risk was minimal, and how we were ever so close to a multi thousand dollar payday. Tomorrow games are thin so will be back on Saturday with more. Onward and upward!
This is a very interesting strategy! I am definitely going to be tailing Saturday though will have to stick to 1/2 or 1/4 unit size for starters. Thanks for contributing win or lose.
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This is a very interesting strategy! I am definitely going to be tailing Saturday though will have to stick to 1/2 or 1/4 unit size for starters. Thanks for contributing win or lose.
Also I wanted to ask, do you find yourself hedging if you find so much to be riding on a given late game of the night that is close late in the game with live betting available for it?
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Also I wanted to ask, do you find yourself hedging if you find so much to be riding on a given late game of the night that is close late in the game with live betting available for it?
I appreciate the ask! I've hedged up to $5k before candidly it all depends on whether or not I've one that day, or feeling the urge to roll the dice. Hedging is subjective in nature and subject to personal circumstance, so I'd just advise that "you do you".
On a side note, for those who don't "get it" with what I'm doing, and don't understand some basic statistical precepts, or just love trolling, please don't bother with spamming this thread with your ignorant garbage. Quick reference for the doubters, here's a four teamer from this month that won me $20k from the three that hit, and was just shy of $50k. And barring a fluke, will win me a $7k bad beat jackpot in a few days:
So for those like Westra who want to learn or have a constructive dialogue, I'm here to chat. And as always, BOL to all.
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I appreciate the ask! I've hedged up to $5k before candidly it all depends on whether or not I've one that day, or feeling the urge to roll the dice. Hedging is subjective in nature and subject to personal circumstance, so I'd just advise that "you do you".
On a side note, for those who don't "get it" with what I'm doing, and don't understand some basic statistical precepts, or just love trolling, please don't bother with spamming this thread with your ignorant garbage. Quick reference for the doubters, here's a four teamer from this month that won me $20k from the three that hit, and was just shy of $50k. And barring a fluke, will win me a $7k bad beat jackpot in a few days:
Ok right on, I think I would have to lean towards hedging more often than not in the early going, but I guess the good part of them all being dogs is that it wouldn't be worth doing anyway unless the dog in question had done enough to adjust the live odds in their favour for that hedge candidate game. Also I wanted to ask, so obviously in todays example you had one 11-combo set with real long shots at $50/u and another set at $30/u.. So do you anticipate always having two sets on high volume game days? And do you think you'll adjust units higher or lower if you really have a strong feeling about a given set or stick to $50 & $30? Cheers.
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Ok right on, I think I would have to lean towards hedging more often than not in the early going, but I guess the good part of them all being dogs is that it wouldn't be worth doing anyway unless the dog in question had done enough to adjust the live odds in their favour for that hedge candidate game. Also I wanted to ask, so obviously in todays example you had one 11-combo set with real long shots at $50/u and another set at $30/u.. So do you anticipate always having two sets on high volume game days? And do you think you'll adjust units higher or lower if you really have a strong feeling about a given set or stick to $50 & $30? Cheers.
I'm pretty flexible with how I play. I have discretionary income when it comes to this format so I'm not locked into a set $ or amount of groups. Going forward I'll advise of how a) I'm going to play it and b) advising how those on tighter budgets should play.
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I'm pretty flexible with how I play. I have discretionary income when it comes to this format so I'm not locked into a set $ or amount of groups. Going forward I'll advise of how a) I'm going to play it and b) advising how those on tighter budgets should play.
So let's use more understandable numbers. If you do a 4 team round Robin, and put 10 dollars on each team that would cost you 40? And roughly if you win 1 every let's say 4 days that would net a profit or at least break even? Even if you only get 2 teams out of the 4? I know it kinda depends on how much the ml is but am I following correctly?
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So let's use more understandable numbers. If you do a 4 team round Robin, and put 10 dollars on each team that would cost you 40? And roughly if you win 1 every let's say 4 days that would net a profit or at least break even? Even if you only get 2 teams out of the 4? I know it kinda depends on how much the ml is but am I following correctly?
Hey Brian. You're close. There are 11 combinations across 4 teams.
6 (six) two team parlays
4 (four) three team parlays
1 (one) four team parlay
And yes, the payouts are purely dependent on the ML odds. I gravitate toward games where the spreads are 9+ points as the ML values offer higher multiples when parlayed. There are days (like today) when there are enough underdogs in the sub-9 points spreads to create two separate 4-team groupings. Fortunately the sub-9 group hit 2-4 which offset the loss in the above-9 grouping. Now if UTEP had held on in the sub-9 group, it would have paid thousands. Now if three teams had hit in the above-9 group, it would have paid $20k+
Make sense? In the end you can chose two bet one of two ways:
- Think you're smarter than the bookies and bet tons of spreads and hope to win 60% or more and eek out profits (and if you do, you're probably not reading covers.com
- Alternatively, employ my strategy, risk less, have a helluva lot more fun watching the games as payout potentials are much higher, and try to take advantage of ML parlay odds disparities and win some real money.
Hope it all makes sense for ya!
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Hey Brian. You're close. There are 11 combinations across 4 teams.
6 (six) two team parlays
4 (four) three team parlays
1 (one) four team parlay
And yes, the payouts are purely dependent on the ML odds. I gravitate toward games where the spreads are 9+ points as the ML values offer higher multiples when parlayed. There are days (like today) when there are enough underdogs in the sub-9 points spreads to create two separate 4-team groupings. Fortunately the sub-9 group hit 2-4 which offset the loss in the above-9 grouping. Now if UTEP had held on in the sub-9 group, it would have paid thousands. Now if three teams had hit in the above-9 group, it would have paid $20k+
Make sense? In the end you can chose two bet one of two ways:
- Think you're smarter than the bookies and bet tons of spreads and hope to win 60% or more and eek out profits (and if you do, you're probably not reading covers.com
- Alternatively, employ my strategy, risk less, have a helluva lot more fun watching the games as payout potentials are much higher, and try to take advantage of ML parlay odds disparities and win some real money.
And as a quick follow up... You asked about how many days you need to win to break even. Historically I've averaged out to hitting 1 in 4 or 5 sets to break even. That said, I don't play for the 2-4... I do this In pursuit of the 3-eamers, as that's where the real money is. I could go winless (not even two teams) for weeks, then hit a 3 teamer and win it all back 2 or 3x over. And again, if you don't believe this is a feasible strategy, just review the last two weeks of CBB games and count the amount of +400 wins that occurred. The total far outweighs the aggregate odds... Hence the opportunity you're playing for.
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And as a quick follow up... You asked about how many days you need to win to break even. Historically I've averaged out to hitting 1 in 4 or 5 sets to break even. That said, I don't play for the 2-4... I do this In pursuit of the 3-eamers, as that's where the real money is. I could go winless (not even two teams) for weeks, then hit a 3 teamer and win it all back 2 or 3x over. And again, if you don't believe this is a feasible strategy, just review the last two weeks of CBB games and count the amount of +400 wins that occurred. The total far outweighs the aggregate odds... Hence the opportunity you're playing for.
You're definitely gonna have some trolls on this because most are afraid of dogs. Please ignore them and keep posting this is a pretty interesting approach. Do what works for you!
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You're definitely gonna have some trolls on this because most are afraid of dogs. Please ignore them and keep posting this is a pretty interesting approach. Do what works for you!
Welcome aboard. Aside the fact Sixers just owned January and are on an unprecedented tear, Embiid was snuffed yesterday for the all star game. Tonight (on a weeks rest) should be a mega "darn you to the league" performance.
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Welcome aboard. Aside the fact Sixers just owned January and are on an unprecedented tear, Embiid was snuffed yesterday for the all star game. Tonight (on a weeks rest) should be a mega "darn you to the league" performance.
Thank for the info. Appreciate anyone who is willing to contribute. I like the style of thinking, and the logic behind it makes sense. Now if we only hit a 4 teamer
I notice you post from nitrogen sports. Do you prefer that book? Have you had any deposit or payout issues?
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Parlay,
Thank for the info. Appreciate anyone who is willing to contribute. I like the style of thinking, and the logic behind it makes sense. Now if we only hit a 4 teamer
I notice you post from nitrogen sports. Do you prefer that book? Have you had any deposit or payout issues?
Hey Brian. You're close. There are 11 combinations across 4 teams.
6 (six) two team parlays
4 (four) three team parlays
1 (one) four team parlay
And yes, the payouts are purely dependent on the ML odds. I gravitate toward games where the spreads are 9+ points as the ML values offer higher multiples when parlayed. There are days (like today) when there are enough underdogs in the sub-9 points spreads to create two separate 4-team groupings. Fortunately the sub-9 group hit 2-4 which offset the loss in the above-9 grouping. Now if UTEP had held on in the sub-9 group, it would have paid thousands. Now if three teams had hit in the above-9 group, it would have paid $20k+
Make sense? In the end you can chose two bet one of two ways:
- Think you're smarter than the bookies and bet tons of spreads and hope to win 60% or more and eek out profits (and if you do, you're probably not reading covers.com
- Alternatively, employ my strategy, risk less, have a helluva lot more fun watching the games as payout potentials are much higher, and try to take advantage of ML parlay odds disparities and win some real money.
Hope it all makes sense for ya!
You are a smart man...thanks for contributing
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Quote Originally Posted by theparlaypicker:
Hey Brian. You're close. There are 11 combinations across 4 teams.
6 (six) two team parlays
4 (four) three team parlays
1 (one) four team parlay
And yes, the payouts are purely dependent on the ML odds. I gravitate toward games where the spreads are 9+ points as the ML values offer higher multiples when parlayed. There are days (like today) when there are enough underdogs in the sub-9 points spreads to create two separate 4-team groupings. Fortunately the sub-9 group hit 2-4 which offset the loss in the above-9 grouping. Now if UTEP had held on in the sub-9 group, it would have paid thousands. Now if three teams had hit in the above-9 group, it would have paid $20k+
Make sense? In the end you can chose two bet one of two ways:
- Think you're smarter than the bookies and bet tons of spreads and hope to win 60% or more and eek out profits (and if you do, you're probably not reading covers.com
- Alternatively, employ my strategy, risk less, have a helluva lot more fun watching the games as payout potentials are much higher, and try to take advantage of ML parlay odds disparities and win some real money.
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