Xavier Worthy's speed would look unreal with Josh Allen's arm!
It would also make Diggs that much more dangerous.
Buffalo needs to retool some of their defense so I don't see it happening BUT, it wasn't defense that let them down this playoff, it was not putting enough points up on the board.
Also, will JJ McCarthy get picked in the top 15? He looked damn smooth and throwing easy. His accuracy was only off with college players by leading them with the ball I noticed, which is what scouts want. An NFL receiver will get most of those
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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To remove first post, remove entire topic.
Xavier Worthy's speed would look unreal with Josh Allen's arm!
It would also make Diggs that much more dangerous.
Buffalo needs to retool some of their defense so I don't see it happening BUT, it wasn't defense that let them down this playoff, it was not putting enough points up on the board.
Also, will JJ McCarthy get picked in the top 15? He looked damn smooth and throwing easy. His accuracy was only off with college players by leading them with the ball I noticed, which is what scouts want. An NFL receiver will get most of those
Penix best pure drop back passer Ive probably ever seen in college guy can put the ball anywhere and does that better than any qb in the draft probably should be first qb taken shame others are talked about and him not as much. I like Mccarthy but I wonder how well he can read defenses. Its rare to see him drop back and pass. He usually holds the ball and then scrambles around before passing.
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Penix best pure drop back passer Ive probably ever seen in college guy can put the ball anywhere and does that better than any qb in the draft probably should be first qb taken shame others are talked about and him not as much. I like Mccarthy but I wonder how well he can read defenses. Its rare to see him drop back and pass. He usually holds the ball and then scrambles around before passing.
Good QB needy list. Wonder if Giants and Vikings would be too cap committed and hence have to move to another position of need given the lack of cap space dedicated to Jones and Cousins. I don't see Bowers dropping out of the top 10. Honestly should be top 5. The dude is the real deal and probably the most complete TE to come out of college in a really long time. The guy is an instant playmaker and can really hold the edge in both the passing game and especially as a road grader in the running game. Those type of prospects are immediate upgrades to your offense on both fronts and frankly hard for a team to pass up if they are already pretty close to going the distance. Imagine Bowers playing for the Chargers. Yes they have needs other places too but this could complete their offense (assuming and this is a BIG assumption) everyone stays healthy on offense. Their D has talent it was just clear that Staley can't coach.
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@dubz4dummyz
Good QB needy list. Wonder if Giants and Vikings would be too cap committed and hence have to move to another position of need given the lack of cap space dedicated to Jones and Cousins. I don't see Bowers dropping out of the top 10. Honestly should be top 5. The dude is the real deal and probably the most complete TE to come out of college in a really long time. The guy is an instant playmaker and can really hold the edge in both the passing game and especially as a road grader in the running game. Those type of prospects are immediate upgrades to your offense on both fronts and frankly hard for a team to pass up if they are already pretty close to going the distance. Imagine Bowers playing for the Chargers. Yes they have needs other places too but this could complete their offense (assuming and this is a BIG assumption) everyone stays healthy on offense. Their D has talent it was just clear that Staley can't coach.
Thinking 4 QBs go top 14...to many teams looking for a QB... Chi if they don't keep fields Wsh Ne Nyg Atl Min even if they sign cousins Den Lv No Curious where bowers goes....could slide just cause he plays TE Wonder if fashanu slides....loaded OL class That 40 time lock worthy into the 1st? Thought I saw him mocked in the 40-70 range pre-combine
Combine is for proper NFL talent eyetest assessment.
A talent like Worthy who proved last year to be a gamechanger in situations for Texas, and then backs it up. As long as his hands are good, the speed will be a major asset and he may be in a battle with Tyrek Hill soon as fastest receiver. Here is a list of fast speeds in games last year....shockingly, most are RBs, so imagine Worthy gets even stronger like Tyrek? https://sports.betmgm.com/en/blog/fastest-nfl-players/
NOT FEATURING AT COMBINE:
The fact that Caleb decided to not feature himself a little, just to preserve his status is bothersome if I were picking. I believe he regressed mentally inverse to his maturity last year at USC. I wouldn't pick him first overall.
I think #1 picks should go for freak lineman on both sides of the ball since they disrupt the game much more than a prima donna QB who likes waiting way too long to throw the ball (it won't work in the NFL as well)
Not a Caleb hater, since in the previous year, I would have been prepared to take him as a top 2 pick based on what I saw
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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Quote Originally Posted by dubz4dummyz:
Thinking 4 QBs go top 14...to many teams looking for a QB... Chi if they don't keep fields Wsh Ne Nyg Atl Min even if they sign cousins Den Lv No Curious where bowers goes....could slide just cause he plays TE Wonder if fashanu slides....loaded OL class That 40 time lock worthy into the 1st? Thought I saw him mocked in the 40-70 range pre-combine
Combine is for proper NFL talent eyetest assessment.
A talent like Worthy who proved last year to be a gamechanger in situations for Texas, and then backs it up. As long as his hands are good, the speed will be a major asset and he may be in a battle with Tyrek Hill soon as fastest receiver. Here is a list of fast speeds in games last year....shockingly, most are RBs, so imagine Worthy gets even stronger like Tyrek? https://sports.betmgm.com/en/blog/fastest-nfl-players/
NOT FEATURING AT COMBINE:
The fact that Caleb decided to not feature himself a little, just to preserve his status is bothersome if I were picking. I believe he regressed mentally inverse to his maturity last year at USC. I wouldn't pick him first overall.
I think #1 picks should go for freak lineman on both sides of the ball since they disrupt the game much more than a prima donna QB who likes waiting way too long to throw the ball (it won't work in the NFL as well)
Not a Caleb hater, since in the previous year, I would have been prepared to take him as a top 2 pick based on what I saw
Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29"
Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29"
Penix best pure drop back passer Ive probably ever seen in college guy can put the ball anywhere and does that better than any qb in the draft probably should be first qb taken shame others are talked about and him not as much. I like Mccarthy but I wonder how well he can read defenses. Its rare to see him drop back and pass. He usually holds the ball and then scrambles around before passing.
No argument!
At the combine for McCarthy and Penix, they were looking at feet, release speed and ease of throw on timing patterns.......
....one 2024 NFL Prospects report says this:
Inconsistent athletic left-handed QB with good pocket mobility. Raw looking. Can move around, but prefers not to take off. Leads with a slower methodical tempo. Most comfortable throwing short range passes. Settles a lot for safety valve throws. Can lock in and not go through progressions. Tendency to hold the ball too long. Timing looks off. Throwing mechanics vary. Undependable throwing. Sometimes looks like he is pushing the ball out. Prefers throwing short or deep (inconsistent at both levels). Good arm. Can look uncomfortable throwing intermediate routes. Struggles reading coverages. Ball tends to sail high or overthrow. Slides when he runs. Poor man’s version of former NFL QB Rodney Peete.
McCarthy > harder to find info on it but here are his Combine stats on Release:
J.J. McCarthy QB Michigan NFL Draft Profile & Scouting Report Overall Rating: 86.2 / 100 Release Speed: 81% Short Passing: 79% Medium Passing: 89% Long Passing: 91%
PENIX was better!
Michael Penix Jr. QB Washington NFL Draft Profile & Scouting Report Overall Rating: 89.5 / 100 Release Speed: 84% Short Passing: 84% Medium Passing: 93% Long Passing: 93%
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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Quote Originally Posted by rosswin97:
Penix best pure drop back passer Ive probably ever seen in college guy can put the ball anywhere and does that better than any qb in the draft probably should be first qb taken shame others are talked about and him not as much. I like Mccarthy but I wonder how well he can read defenses. Its rare to see him drop back and pass. He usually holds the ball and then scrambles around before passing.
No argument!
At the combine for McCarthy and Penix, they were looking at feet, release speed and ease of throw on timing patterns.......
....one 2024 NFL Prospects report says this:
Inconsistent athletic left-handed QB with good pocket mobility. Raw looking. Can move around, but prefers not to take off. Leads with a slower methodical tempo. Most comfortable throwing short range passes. Settles a lot for safety valve throws. Can lock in and not go through progressions. Tendency to hold the ball too long. Timing looks off. Throwing mechanics vary. Undependable throwing. Sometimes looks like he is pushing the ball out. Prefers throwing short or deep (inconsistent at both levels). Good arm. Can look uncomfortable throwing intermediate routes. Struggles reading coverages. Ball tends to sail high or overthrow. Slides when he runs. Poor man’s version of former NFL QB Rodney Peete.
McCarthy > harder to find info on it but here are his Combine stats on Release:
J.J. McCarthy QB Michigan NFL Draft Profile & Scouting Report Overall Rating: 86.2 / 100 Release Speed: 81% Short Passing: 79% Medium Passing: 89% Long Passing: 91%
PENIX was better!
Michael Penix Jr. QB Washington NFL Draft Profile & Scouting Report Overall Rating: 89.5 / 100 Release Speed: 84% Short Passing: 84% Medium Passing: 93% Long Passing: 93%
Thinking 4 QBs go top 14...to many teams looking for a QB... Chi if they don't keep fields Wsh Ne Nyg Atl Min even if they sign cousins Den Lv No Curious where bowers goes....could slide just cause he plays TE Wonder if fashanu slides....loaded OL class That 40 time lock worthy into the 1st? Thought I saw him mocked in the 40-70 range pre-combine
There seems to be a JJ McCarthy hype train that keeps picking up steam. It's no secret that every year there is a QB or too that is overvalued, but worth risking drafting a little higher for the hope they become their franchise QB.
In reading the Twitter/X landscape there is a sentiment that McCarthy could go top 5. As a Chargers fan, I'm really hoping that's the case. For one, the Chargers don't need a QB. So wanna trade with the Chargers? Go right ahead! Oh, so you'd rather trade with the Cardinals? Well, then let Marvin Harrison Jr. fall into the Chargers lap, thankyouverymuch.
A few months ago it was unfathomable that MHJ would drop past the Cardinals; and maybe it's a situation in which he wouldn't fall past the Patriots. Heck, the Commanders simply trading up with the Bears still remains a distinct possibility. And then who knows what the Bears do here. (They still haven't traded Fields, and apparently the market is lukewarm for him; but he's still available.)
Everything I just wrote is a long-winded way of saying anything can happen. Penix elevated his draft stock. McCarthy's combine performance raised some doubts, but also amplified what teams are already excited about.
Pro Day should help separate the pack.
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Quote Originally Posted by dubz4dummyz:
Thinking 4 QBs go top 14...to many teams looking for a QB... Chi if they don't keep fields Wsh Ne Nyg Atl Min even if they sign cousins Den Lv No Curious where bowers goes....could slide just cause he plays TE Wonder if fashanu slides....loaded OL class That 40 time lock worthy into the 1st? Thought I saw him mocked in the 40-70 range pre-combine
There seems to be a JJ McCarthy hype train that keeps picking up steam. It's no secret that every year there is a QB or too that is overvalued, but worth risking drafting a little higher for the hope they become their franchise QB.
In reading the Twitter/X landscape there is a sentiment that McCarthy could go top 5. As a Chargers fan, I'm really hoping that's the case. For one, the Chargers don't need a QB. So wanna trade with the Chargers? Go right ahead! Oh, so you'd rather trade with the Cardinals? Well, then let Marvin Harrison Jr. fall into the Chargers lap, thankyouverymuch.
A few months ago it was unfathomable that MHJ would drop past the Cardinals; and maybe it's a situation in which he wouldn't fall past the Patriots. Heck, the Commanders simply trading up with the Bears still remains a distinct possibility. And then who knows what the Bears do here. (They still haven't traded Fields, and apparently the market is lukewarm for him; but he's still available.)
Everything I just wrote is a long-winded way of saying anything can happen. Penix elevated his draft stock. McCarthy's combine performance raised some doubts, but also amplified what teams are already excited about.
@jerson1269 Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29" https://www.si.com/college/georgia/football/2024-nfl-combine-results-tracker Compare to Travis Kelce and the speed difference is shocking, and that alone may lead to him falling in the draft. https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=10397
I hear what you are saying and you make a fair point. But since when has speed ever really mattered for a TE? I don't expect to see many fly routes from him or frankly many TEs in general. He is a great route runner and if he can find the open space over the middle, in the zone D or back of the end zone that is where he is most valuable. Plus there are many a TE that don't have top end speed but they are sneaky fast too. Especially against linebackers.
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Quote Originally Posted by Last2thirst:
@jerson1269 Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29" https://www.si.com/college/georgia/football/2024-nfl-combine-results-tracker Compare to Travis Kelce and the speed difference is shocking, and that alone may lead to him falling in the draft. https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=10397
I hear what you are saying and you make a fair point. But since when has speed ever really mattered for a TE? I don't expect to see many fly routes from him or frankly many TEs in general. He is a great route runner and if he can find the open space over the middle, in the zone D or back of the end zone that is where he is most valuable. Plus there are many a TE that don't have top end speed but they are sneaky fast too. Especially against linebackers.
What do you think of Drake Maye? I don't get the hype. Is he really that much better than Sam Howell who the Commanders are apparently looking to replace?
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@iConsciousness
What do you think of Drake Maye? I don't get the hype. Is he really that much better than Sam Howell who the Commanders are apparently looking to replace?
Penix Jr = poormans Rodgers vibes always looking to extend with his arm
Nix= poormans Tlaw
Jj= Kenny pickett
Guessing at least 4 QBs go top 15 just based on how valuable they are
Penix And nix both older prospects could hurt them but could still go late 1 or 2nd round imo
Dunno if chargers go wr/te or ol with the Harbaugh hire...he will prob want an ol and a good run game to protect Herbert and open up the pass game...like a smart coach would do
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My qb comps
Maye = poor mans Herbert slightly better mobility
Daniels = poor mans Lamar but better passer
Williams= poor man's mahomes
Penix Jr = poormans Rodgers vibes always looking to extend with his arm
Nix= poormans Tlaw
Jj= Kenny pickett
Guessing at least 4 QBs go top 15 just based on how valuable they are
Penix And nix both older prospects could hurt them but could still go late 1 or 2nd round imo
Dunno if chargers go wr/te or ol with the Harbaugh hire...he will prob want an ol and a good run game to protect Herbert and open up the pass game...like a smart coach would do
Word is giants looking at possibly moving up for qb
Not sure if they can get out of Jones contract next year (haven't seen the dead cap figures) but the rookie could play behind him or play right away and Jones an expensive ass backup for year or 2 while the rookie on cheap deal
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@jesron1269
Word is giants looking at possibly moving up for qb
Not sure if they can get out of Jones contract next year (haven't seen the dead cap figures) but the rookie could play behind him or play right away and Jones an expensive ass backup for year or 2 while the rookie on cheap deal
Would take Marvin Harrison Jr over JJ Mc for sure!
Chargers needed help in their secondary or was it their line? One of those two units were ranked 30TH but yes, having Allen all of a sudden wonky requires help for Herbert who is hands down way better than McCarthy could become (I have to be careful because lots said similar things I bet in threads when another Wolverine QB was drafted - much lower albeit)
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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Would take Marvin Harrison Jr over JJ Mc for sure!
Chargers needed help in their secondary or was it their line? One of those two units were ranked 30TH but yes, having Allen all of a sudden wonky requires help for Herbert who is hands down way better than McCarthy could become (I have to be careful because lots said similar things I bet in threads when another Wolverine QB was drafted - much lower albeit)
Quote Originally Posted by Last2thirst: @jerson1269 Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29" https://www.si.com/college/georgia/football/2024-nfl-combine-results-tracker Compare to Travis Kelce and the speed difference is shocking, and that alone may lead to him falling in the draft. https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=10397 I hear what you are saying and you make a fair point. But since when has speed ever really mattered for a TE? I don't expect to see many fly routes from him or frankly many TEs in general. He is a great route runner and if he can find the open space over the middle, in the zone D or back of the end zone that is where he is most valuable. Plus there are many a TE that don't have top end speed but they are sneaky fast too. Especially against linebackers.
Bowers is straight up, the most impressive TE I ever saw as a freshman and when healthy the last couple . I threw in the comparison to show the reality of the NFL is a collection of freak speed and other abilities and yes, there is room for a Mark Andrews and even better, type of TE in the NFL that Bowers. But a check of his speed shows he was 4.67 for the 40 which reinforces the point of the NFL is a freak show and a pass may not be delivered if the QB does not have time to get it to you running your great route.
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
0
Quote Originally Posted by jesron1269:
Quote Originally Posted by Last2thirst: @jerson1269 Some of the combine numbers are excellent and I think the speed is meh, which surprises me as I saw him earlier in his college career as fast for a tight end! Vert is outstanding for a big guy at 29" https://www.si.com/college/georgia/football/2024-nfl-combine-results-tracker Compare to Travis Kelce and the speed difference is shocking, and that alone may lead to him falling in the draft. https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=10397 I hear what you are saying and you make a fair point. But since when has speed ever really mattered for a TE? I don't expect to see many fly routes from him or frankly many TEs in general. He is a great route runner and if he can find the open space over the middle, in the zone D or back of the end zone that is where he is most valuable. Plus there are many a TE that don't have top end speed but they are sneaky fast too. Especially against linebackers.
Bowers is straight up, the most impressive TE I ever saw as a freshman and when healthy the last couple . I threw in the comparison to show the reality of the NFL is a collection of freak speed and other abilities and yes, there is room for a Mark Andrews and even better, type of TE in the NFL that Bowers. But a check of his speed shows he was 4.67 for the 40 which reinforces the point of the NFL is a freak show and a pass may not be delivered if the QB does not have time to get it to you running your great route.
My qb comps Maye = poor mans Herbert slightly better mobility Daniels = poor mans Lamar but better passer Williams= poor man's mahomes Penix Jr = poormans Rodgers vibes always looking to extend with his arm Nix= poormans Tlaw Jj= Kenny pickett Guessing at least 4 QBs go top 15 just based on how valuable they are Penix And nix both older prospects could hurt them but could still go late 1 or 2nd round imo Dunno if chargers go wr/te or ol with the Harbaugh hire...he will prob want an ol and a good run game to protect Herbert and open up the pass game...like a smart coach would do
JJ Mc and Drew Brees throw similarly from load to throw (left arm up and even with throw coil angle)
JJ (2020 > and is actually lowering his posture more now but same action) https://youtu.be/7zecK6uhHZY
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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Quote Originally Posted by dubz4dummyz:
My qb comps Maye = poor mans Herbert slightly better mobility Daniels = poor mans Lamar but better passer Williams= poor man's mahomes Penix Jr = poormans Rodgers vibes always looking to extend with his arm Nix= poormans Tlaw Jj= Kenny pickett Guessing at least 4 QBs go top 15 just based on how valuable they are Penix And nix both older prospects could hurt them but could still go late 1 or 2nd round imo Dunno if chargers go wr/te or ol with the Harbaugh hire...he will prob want an ol and a good run game to protect Herbert and open up the pass game...like a smart coach would do
JJ Mc and Drew Brees throw similarly from load to throw (left arm up and even with throw coil angle)
@Last2thirst Brees was unique with how small he was and how he maneuvered in the pocket Better comp for daniels might be tyrod taylor
Knew when I first laid eyes on JJ in a game I had seen that coiling action the same way and sure enough...you look at those vids....EXACT....finish is close but not exact...and I predict whomever coaches JJ will ask him to finish high like Brees did given the extra sizing on the lines and more arm you want to deploy for touch passes and then use fingers/flick
Proving is hard. Talk is easy.
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Quote Originally Posted by dubz4dummyz:
@Last2thirst Brees was unique with how small he was and how he maneuvered in the pocket Better comp for daniels might be tyrod taylor
Knew when I first laid eyes on JJ in a game I had seen that coiling action the same way and sure enough...you look at those vids....EXACT....finish is close but not exact...and I predict whomever coaches JJ will ask him to finish high like Brees did given the extra sizing on the lines and more arm you want to deploy for touch passes and then use fingers/flick
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. I threw in the comparison to show the reality of the NFL is a collection of freak speed and other abilities and yes, there is room for a Mark Andrews and even better, type of TE in the NFL that Bowers. But a check of his speed shows he was 4.67 for the 40 which reinforces the point of the NFL is a freak show and a pass may not be delivered if the QB does not have time to get it to you running your great route.
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