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OP, if that was your initial reaction to this case, you are one sick, twisted f-ck.
to the poor child and to the poor father who will have to live with this for the rest of his life.
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TheGoldenGoose | 53 |
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As others have pointed out, you should definitely take advantage of situations like this as there is nothing unethical about it.
Not sure if it is still as profitable, but I used to do this all the time with the offshore books a few years back (before the kids came along and before I started to get busier in my career and the cost/benefiit analysis just wasn't the same anymore). If you played the game right 4-5 years ago, and opened your mind to different arb opportunities, $10-$15K a year of risk free income (mostly during NFL/NCAA FB season) was pretty easy.
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rad5577 | 31 |
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DRYS, now that is a flash from the past
I had to pull up my brokerage account just to check out the records on this one. I actually bought this pig at $92.30....and again at $73.44, and again at $59.20, etc. An expensive, but worthwhile lesson as it shaped who I have become as an investor. Fact check. Do your own due diligence. Understand what you are investing in. And above all, stay away from random stock tips on a gambling website
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whereismyhat | 28 |
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First off, above everything else, I wish you best of luck with your investment. I actually have a very, very nominal investment in these more out of curiosity than anything.
With that being said, just because you are quoting facts and figures on here that could potentially influence others (and have obviously influenced your investment strategy), I'd encourage you to fact check a bit better. I researched a bit, and while I do not necessarily question the $7 trillion dinar money supply under the Saddam regime, I will without hesitation 100% assure you that there was not a $7 trillion dinar money supply when it was priced at $3.86. There was a period under the Saddam regime where I believe the rate was closer to 3,500 dinar per $1USD, and if you saw the $7 trillion dinar money supply figure somewhere, it was definitely after Saddam let the printing presses run and the currency had significantly devalued. I do not stand by these figures 100%, but I saw two different links that respectively quoted the money supply at $25 billion dinar and $27 billion dinar respectively when it was priced at $3.86. Again, I would need to fact check a bit further before I'd completely stand by these figures, but they make much more sense, and I'd be surprised if they were materially off. When you work those figures into your calculation above (instead of the $7 trillion) I think it gives you a more realistic idea of potential appreciation for the investment. Also, one post you made earlier, about the E&Y contact, when he was quoting the $1.17 fair value, are you sure it wasn't in the context of the fact that the exchange rate was determined to be 1,170 Dinar : $1 USD? It just seems too coincidental for it not to be the case. I'm not saying he was purposely misleading you, but unless he was personally involved in the audit, he could have very easily misinterpreted, or misquoted the information to you. Anyways, like I said in the first couple of sentences of the post, I do wish you best, but I think it is important for you, and anyone else who invests in these, to realize they are really entirely hanging their hats on the "follow the money" aspect, and the facts and figures really don't support the investment.
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SportsFan9698 | 41 |
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Quote Originally Posted by Lucrative: The Central Bank of Iraq has produced 80 trillion dinar. The GDP of Iraq is $250 billion. If the dinar revalues to even 1 cent the money supply of Iraq will be more than 3 times higher than its GDP (1 cent x 80,000,000,000,000 = 800,000,000,000)! No nation on Earth has a money supply greater than its GDP! The US has a GDP of $16 trillion and a money supply of $10 trillion. Based on it’s GDP, Iraq can support a money supply of about $80 billion dollars and guess what? That’s exactly what the value of their supply is! Interested in the OP's thoughts on this. If accurate, this is a pretty important aspect that seems to have not been addressed in this thread outside of the post I quoted. Even with an assumption of strong growth in Iraq, this seems like it would significantly limit any opportunity for really significant gains that would make this sort of speculative investment remotely worthwhile. It just seems like this is the magic bullet with respect to this and if you don't investigate the accuracy around this, and if you don't think through what it means, you really kind of just have your head in the sand here
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SportsFan9698 | 41 |
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I like it. A nice way to remember him with a personal touch
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JOHNNY_ODAE | 14 |
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Quote Originally Posted by slikstiks99: A lot of this outrage is trumped up in this thread. Did this man really do anything that dramatically different? Killing a baby in any trimester is a nasty business. I don't see how what he did was so much more inhumane. Snipping spinal chords of live babies. Yes, the babies experienced some pain, but they were destined for death any way about it. If you've been circumcised, then you've experienced more pain at birth than any of these babies felt. Abortion is a nasty business any way about it. Though this guy's practices were unprofessional and unethical, he provided a unique service for people that sought it out. Some over dramatics going here. Is this post sick sarcasm? If this is serious, you are probably the most deranged individual I've come across on this site. I've never had that strong of an opinion on abortion one way or the other. Personally, I'm not sure I can stomach the idea of it, but I don't feel comfortable telling a woman what she can do with her body. But....MANY OF THESE BABIES WERE BORN. They were not fetuses. They were, living, breathing, human beings. They may have been "destined for death" in your mind, but that didn't happen. They were delivered alive, breathed fresh air, and no longer were inside a woman's body. Where does it end? I assume you believe it is ok then for a parent to go ahead and kill a 1-year old that cries all night long if they decide they don't want "it" at that point? I live in the Philadelphia area where this occurred, and this was just downright disgusting. The local media has covered it ad-nauseum, and I am shocked it didn't get more national coverage. Anyone posting that this case was "not that bad" did not see any of the pictures associated with this (I made the mistake of clicking on links that showed evidential matter when this first came out a couple of years ago and I'm still horrified). No matter where you stand on abortion, this was an absolute horrific case, and anyone arguing it was not, really should take a long look at themselves in the mirror.
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rick3117 | 38 |
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Quote Originally Posted by hotdamn85: these stocks were meant to day trade... i should of stated that in the first post. if u just randomly buy all the stocks on Monday that is not how i work it. Ah, I got it now, sorry, I missed that aspect in your first post. By day trading, I'm assuming you mean buying each at the low for the week, and selling at the high. Missing the 7% down days, but hitting the 5% up days, no doubt that is quite a profitable strategy. Good luck with your picks going forward
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hotdamn85 | 15 |
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Quote Originally Posted by Rush51: This is a really good discussion with great points by both Wake & Wall.. APPL never traded at absurd valuations as Wake pointed out, and all companies go thru growth , valuation phases as Wall mentioned. Appreciate the comment, I've had a few good discussions with Wall on stocks. Based on the positions we've taken on companies, it seems like we have two completed different methodologies, and I enjoy it because he provides a perspective I sometimes miss as I'm much more focused on earnings related valuations (and I hope I do as well for him as he seems to focus more on growth potential). Nothing is absolute, despite my thoughts, AAPL could go below $100, or despite what Wall thinks, it may never get close to that and $450 will look like a huge bargain a year from now. If we could say for 100% certainty what will happen to any company, we'd all be millionaires. Its all educated guesses, and its good to have as many perspectives as possible when making investing decisions. I just think if you were able to have 100 companies that were identical to AAPL in every way possible (both company-wise and valuation-wise), more than 50 of those would prove to be good investments. Might it not work out in the case of AAPL, sure, but I like the odds. At its current valuation, it almost needs a perfect storm of bad luck to fall significantly further (as opposed to companies with valuations through the roof that almost need the perfect storm of positives to keep up the valuations (i.e, year after year of increased growth). It is being valued like it has completely lost its edge (which it may have), but that is valued in. Any sort of revolutionary product, or earnings surprise down the road, and it takes off. In fact, all it took was a quarter that was not terrible, and the stock is already up about 15% off the low. And there hasn't even been any real strong catalyst, or good news that really should have driven any upward momentum. It currently represents the largest holding in my portfolio as I made a pretty large purchase in the low 430's, and I'm happy so far. I do think a year from now, anyone who didn't buy while it was in the 400's will be kicking themselves, but we'll see.
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Michfan15 | 18 |
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I wish you nothing but good luck the rest of the week, but you've got some ground to make up. Your posts are pretty misleading as these picks haven't fared well, individually, or collectively. An equal investment in each at the closing market price on Friday, and you'd be down over 3% so far on the week (compared to the S&P which is up over 1%).
JOEZ last touched $1.70 on April 29th (a week before your initial post). AVEO was up 5.13% the day after it had gone down over 7%. ZNGA is up 4% today, after being down about 3% on the week before that. Hopefully OSH bounces for you, but it needs to be taken in the context that it is down over 15% so far on the week. Again, I wish you nothing but the best on your picks (I actually own JOEZ so I'm especially rooting for that one), and am not flaming you, but your posts are implying the picks have been good, when they really just haven't (at least up to now)
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hotdamn85 | 15 |
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Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: wake, I would say a better comparison would be Blackberry..meaning the peak to trough fall since they are much more similar than AAPL is to MSFT. Wall, I don't disagree with a lot you are saying, but you are completely ignoring valuation in your analysis. BBRY (or RIMM back then) was trading at a P/E close to 50 at its peak, a solid three times higher valuation than AAPL. And that is forgetting the cash/investments AAPL has, which is well over $100 billion (and alone, worth more than $100 a share). Backing that out, its valuation was even lower. Company-wise, possibly even moat-wise, I'd agree, AAPL may be a bit closer to BBRY than MSFT, but valuation-wise, it isn't close to either when comparing peaks. If AAPL was trading at a P/E of 50 at the height of its valuation, maybe you see a similar decline you saw with BBRY in a worst case scenario if they never develop another innovative product. When it was around 15 or 16 at $700 a share, with over $100 per share just in cash/investments, no way you see that significant of a decline. Growth has been slowing, margins are declining, but it is still a cash flow generating machine. Despite the slowing business, they are still generating a ton of cash (i.e., the earnings are strong, not just accounting gains). We've discussed a few different companies in the past, I know our strategies/methodologies are different, but plenty of investors can see value in a Company that may not grow at 20% a year, and its margins might be coming back down to earth a bit. I know you have disdain for the Company (and its "slave" labor), and I know you prefer companies in growth stages, but come on, AAPL below $100 a share (heck, even below $300 a share), is just plain silly |
Michfan15 | 18 |
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Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: This stock will go under 100 long term..margins will compress and sales will slow. Every stock in history moves from growth to maturity, AAPL will be no different. Outside of a large, significant market correction, I think we might have seen the bottom on AAPL. To ever trade below $100 a share nominally, this would need to split at least 3:1 You wouldn't get an argument from me that every stock in history eventually moved from growth to maturity, but what you are not considering is that not many growth stocks like AAPL were priced at a P/E of about 16 in the middle of its growth phase at the peak of its market cap. The stocks you are remembering that lost 85-90% of their value were the ones trading at ridiculous valuations to begin with. These days, everyone wants to compare AAPL to Microsoft. Looking back at Microsoft, on a split adjusted basis, peak to valley, it saw approximately a 63% decline. Applying the same 63% decline to AAPL's peak of 705, that would take you to about $265. However, MSFT was trading at a P/E of about 70-80 at its peak, huge difference between that and a P/E of 16. AAPL was already priced as if it was a non-growth, mature company. It will never even see $265 (ignoring stock splits) let alone $100. Right now, it is trading at about 10-11 times earnings. There is a lot of room for declining margins, and slowing growth, already priced in. The only reason it fell so quickly these past 9 months or so was because its market cap was too large to support that quick of a movement up it saw the 9 months before that. Every fund under the sun was overexposed to AAPL on the run up (even dividend funds were relying too heavily on it). As it started declining, funds that should never have been that exposed dumped, and the cycle perpetuated. There is only so much investable capital to go around, and in about a 9 month timeframe, AAPL's market cap increased by about $250-$300 billion. That increase alone would rank as one of the largest companies in the world, and that was just new investing capital generated in just 9 months, not even including the investor base that existed prior to that market cap generation. That sort of growth in investor capital is just not sustainable. What you see now is a company that is appropriately valued for what it is, a company that is no longer a growth story, and may not be the same innovative company it was in the past. But, it is currently priced at a similar valuation to Microsoft. So, you've basically got the built in upside of the Company coming out with something unique that brings them back to the forefront for free, with the fall back of the valuation of a Microsoft. Not sure I see a lot of downside here, and definitely not the potential 80% downside you were alluding to. |
Michfan15 | 18 |
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Quote Originally Posted by TheGoldenGoose: The GWB Presidency was so horribly corrupt, and the American people so painfully disgusted, that you might never see another Republican President in your lifetime. How bad was it, you ask? It was so bad, the American people elected the first Black President, and then re-elected him. Now, that's bad. Those are the stone cold facts. Ok, fair enough, although my post was more directed towards those who might have an open mind, not retreads from the politics forum Keep clinging to your "stone cold facts" and your precious metals while you are at. I'm sure that stubborn and biased mindset will continue to serve you well.
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DoubleUp4Life | 52 |
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Quote Originally Posted by kaponofor3: DJBROW Facts vs. Opinions Well informed neutral position vs. biased uninformed position djbrow
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Stiln | 52 |
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Quote Originally Posted by woodsy5822: All i know is Bush atleast wouldnt let people mess with us.. 9/11 happened and he did the best he could to ge the right people.. The details can be argued. I get that..bin laden and sadaam were considered threats.. I appreciate that he tried to make the worls a better place.. I'm not a huge Bush fan, but I've grown to feel almost obligated to stick up for him because of this very reason. His presidency was really tough. Probably, the toughest 8 years any American president faced. He obviously made mistakes, but as an American, seeing no real terrorist attacks on the US after 9/11, I look at that as a huge success, one which he is given no credit for by the Monday morning quaterbacks who criticize everything he did. The way he was vilified by the media was despicable. The fact that the majority of Americans can't separate fact from propaganda is really scary. All it takes is revisiting the name "Cindy Sheehan" to prove this point. There are many other examples I could point to. To anyone with a open mind, (I've found there aren't many in the Politics Forum on this site, maybe the GD forum will be a bit better) I'd encourage you to read his "autobiography" Decision Points. The writing style is atrocious, but it does at least let the man defend himself and his actions. My takeaway (which is different than the image he attempts to project) was that he was unfortunately, one of the more under-qualified presidents we've had, in probably the most challenging time the country has had for a president. But, his intent was good, and for that, I respect him. I think (and hope) over time, his legacy will improve a bit. I think a big step towards that will be the next Republican president we have. There is no argument that the media in this country is liberally biased, and pushes a lot of agendas/creates biases in people's mind. Throwing in the "social media" aspect which Bush was the first Republican president to ever have to face, the man never stood a chance. For better (or worse) the next Republican president will provide a new target for that media bias/hatred, and the average American will forget just "how bad Bush was" in the context of the new target |
DoubleUp4Life | 52 |
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Dollar cost averaging on a 2x VIX ETF with a chart that looks like this: Hope you catch that spike you are hoping for soon If not, you might want to consider cutting and running and taking your losses. Getting stubborn over a position like this could end up wiping you out. 2x funds like this are trading tools, you've got to be careful holding these longer term, especially when it is something like 2x on VXX which is a decaying position to begin with |
CraigBuchanan | 42 |
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Quote Originally Posted by TheGoldenGoose:
Bullshiit. Stay away from Wall Street completely. Sorry, meant to quote your condescending response to my post, not the one I did above. |
mdrsports31 | 49 |
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Oh wait, never mind, I went back and re-read your earlier post. Put it all in precious metals. In this current market.
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mdrsports31 | 49 |
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Quote Originally Posted by TheGoldenGoose:
Stock market is a terrible short term investment. Get your money out immediately. Be happy you only lost $5K. Hold some precious metals in the meantime. What should he do, gamble it away? Oh wise one, tell me what great investment ideas do you have? If you need the money within a couple of years, you tread carefully. If you are looking to put it away for the future, and can live with the ups and downs, you put it in the market in SPY, or some balanced mutual fund. Not even debatable |
mdrsports31 | 49 |
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If you are young and don't know what you are doing in the market, SPY makes the most sense. If you want some diversification away from equities, find a nice balanced, low fee mutual fund. At your age, and with your lack of experience, anything else you do will be fighting an uphill battle |
mdrsports31 | 49 |
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