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    All Forums | Systems & Strategies

    NBA 2009 - Top 5 / Bottom 5

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    jonnymega
    MontanaMax
    KissAPistol
    nolemonasses
    KMang
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    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 27, 2009 - 6:17 PM ET #1

    Normal 0 false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4

    Hi -

     

    Here’s a system I thought I would share that I am trying out for the first time this year.

     

    Basically, after studying last year’s schedules for trends, I noticed that the Lakers, Boston, and Cleveland never lost 3 games in a row. Furthermore, Sacramento and Milwaukee never won 3 in a row. In fact, I don’t think Sac even won two in a row.

     

    Now, according to current power rankings from different sites, as well as offseason observations, it seems that the top 3 teams mentioned above have improved their teams over the summer. Additionally, it seems things are still going to suck for Sacramento fans and Milwaukee fans. So what should we do with this information?

     

    I’m going to suggest trying a Top 5 Bottom 5 ABC strategy throughout the season. The top 5 teams I am choosing are: LAL, CLE, BOS, SA, and ORL. The Bottom 5 teams this year, in my opinion, are going to be SAC, MIL, MIN, NY and MEM.

     

    Basically, instead of playing all 82 games, this system only calls for playing the home games for the Top 5 and the away games for the Bottom 5. This will hopefully ensure success for the system.

     

    The Top 5 are not series chases, but the Bottom 5 are. In other words, you are playing every Top 5 Home game. If they leave town after losing your A bet, play the B bet when they return for their next home series. As for the Bottom 5, you are only playing the first 3 games of each away series with 3 games or more. When you win that series with the A, B or C bet, you are done until the next away series.

     

    Now, I’m sure this kind system has been done before and I certainly don’t claim it as my own. I will say, however, that after going over the numbers from last season, and taking into account the development of the teams over the summer, this system looks promising. I figure that each of the teams can afford one C bet loss. Last year, out of these 10 teams, that only happened once with SA and they are a much better team this year.

     

    As for MM, feel free to use whatever ABC system that you are comfortable with. Personally, I am starting out with a 5-5 Lauberge. My first bet is to win $10 (5+5). Any losses are split between the A, B and C betting lines for that team and added to the end of that line. For example, CLE hosts BOS tonight. The juice is (was) -200, so I made a $20 bet to win $10 (5+5 from the A betting line). If  CLE wins, our betting lines all stay at

    5-5. But if BOS wins, we will take the $20 we lost, divide by three (and round up to the next dollar) and add it to A, B and C so each of our CLE lines will be 5-5-7. The next bet will be to win $12. If we win that bet, take off the two outside numbers and go back to 5-5.

     

    Finally, I made a spreadsheet with all of the picks for this year. The Top 5 teams are on the left and the Bottom 5 teams are on the right.

     

    https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ap3Khvy1Y2TIdFFpSjlvOG91VFNfLVh0WUxUTnlNR3c&hl=en

     

     

    Good Luck and thanks for any suggestion, tips, or thoughts!





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    Normal 0 false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4

    Hi -

     

    Here’s a system I thought I would share that I am trying out for the first time this year.

     

    Basically, after studying last year’s schedules for trends, I noticed that the Lakers, Boston, and Cleveland never lost 3 games in a row. Furthermore, Sacramento and Milwaukee never won 3 in a row. In fact, I don’t think Sac even won two in a row.

     

    Now, according to current power rankings from different sites, as well as offseason observations, it seems that the top 3 teams mentioned above have improved their teams over the summer. Additionally, it seems things are still going to suck for Sacramento fans and Milwaukee fans. So what should we do with this information?

     

    I’m going to suggest trying a Top 5 Bottom 5 ABC strategy throughout the season. The top 5 teams I am choosing are: LAL, CLE, BOS, SA, and ORL. The Bottom 5 teams this year, in my opinion, are going to be SAC, MIL, MIN, NY and MEM.

     

    Basically, instead of playing all 82 games, this system only calls for playing the home games for the Top 5 and the away games for the Bottom 5. This will hopefully ensure success for the system.

     

    The Top 5 are not series chases, but the Bottom 5 are. In other words, you are playing every Top 5 Home game. If they leave town after losing your A bet, play the B bet when they return for their next home series. As for the Bottom 5, you are only playing the first 3 games of each away series with 3 games or more. When you win that series with the A, B or C bet, you are done until the next away series.

     

    Now, I’m sure this kind system has been done before and I certainly don’t claim it as my own. I will say, however, that after going over the numbers from last season, and taking into account the development of the teams over the summer, this system looks promising. I figure that each of the teams can afford one C bet loss. Last year, out of these 10 teams, that only happened once with SA and they are a much better team this year.

     

    As for MM, feel free to use whatever ABC system that you are comfortable with. Personally, I am starting out with a 5-5 Lauberge. My first bet is to win $10 (5+5). Any losses are split between the A, B and C betting lines for that team and added to the end of that line. For example, CLE hosts BOS tonight. The juice is (was) -200, so I made a $20 bet to win $10 (5+5 from the A betting line). If  CLE wins, our betting lines all stay at

    5-5. But if BOS wins, we will take the $20 we lost, divide by three (and round up to the next dollar) and add it to A, B and C so each of our CLE lines will be 5-5-7. The next bet will be to win $12. If we win that bet, take off the two outside numbers and go back to 5-5.

     

    Finally, I made a spreadsheet with all of the picks for this year. The Top 5 teams are on the left and the Bottom 5 teams are on the right.

     

    https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ap3Khvy1Y2TIdFFpSjlvOG91VFNfLVh0WUxUTnlNR3c&hl=en

     

     

    Good Luck and thanks for any suggestion, tips, or thoughts!





     
    MontanaMax
    MontanaMax
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    Posted: Oct. 27, 2009 - 7:01 PM ET #2

    Seems interesting
    You talking about ML's right?
    GL bro.............
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    Seems interesting
    You talking about ML's right?
    GL bro.............
     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 27, 2009 - 7:41 PM ET #3

    Yes! And I forgot to post tonight's picks:

    LAL  ML to win $10 (huge juice)
    CLE ML to win $10


    GL!!!
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    Yes! And I forgot to post tonight's picks:

    LAL  ML to win $10 (huge juice)
    CLE ML to win $10


    GL!!!
     
    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 10:19 AM ET #4


    LAL - W
    CLE - L

    -1 unit on the season.

    The next time CLE plays at home it will be a B bet.

    Today's picks

    A - BOS
    A - SA
    A - ORL
    A - OKC (to beat SAC)

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    LAL - W
    CLE - L

    -1 unit on the season.

    The next time CLE plays at home it will be a B bet.

    Today's picks

    A - BOS
    A - SA
    A - ORL
    A - OKC (to beat SAC)

     
    KissAPistol
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 1:07 PM ET #5

    Are you talking ML or on the spread?  You seem to be referring to ML.  How are you down only one unit if you went 1-1 yesterday? 

    If you are playing this on the ML, you are insane.  You could potentially lose over 2 grand with one single loss trying to win $10 if all three games of the chase end up being -500 to -900 favorites which is very likely.  3 of your 4 "A" games today are -500 or higher.
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    Are you talking ML or on the spread?  You seem to be referring to ML.  How are you down only one unit if you went 1-1 yesterday? 

    If you are playing this on the ML, you are insane.  You could potentially lose over 2 grand with one single loss trying to win $10 if all three games of the chase end up being -500 to -900 favorites which is very likely.  3 of your 4 "A" games today are -500 or higher.
     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 1:39 PM ET #6

    Hey KAP...

    You're right. These are ML bets, so the juice can be high. That's why the losses are spread out across the A, B and C lines. Time will tell if I need to spread the losses out across all 30 betting lines, but for now it's just spread out across the losing team's lines.

    I'm still waiting on my book to post it's MLs, but so far it looks like the plays are going to be about $35 -$60 each.

    Finally, the system is down 1 unit because the Lakers won (+$10) and Cleveland lost (-200 ML). $10 - $20 = -$10 which is -1 unit ($10/unit).


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    Hey KAP...

    You're right. These are ML bets, so the juice can be high. That's why the losses are spread out across the A, B and C lines. Time will tell if I need to spread the losses out across all 30 betting lines, but for now it's just spread out across the losing team's lines.

    I'm still waiting on my book to post it's MLs, but so far it looks like the plays are going to be about $35 -$60 each.

    Finally, the system is down 1 unit because the Lakers won (+$10) and Cleveland lost (-200 ML). $10 - $20 = -$10 which is -1 unit ($10/unit).


     
    nolemonasses
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 1:57 PM ET #7

    Juicy, but interesting.

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    Juicy, but interesting.

     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 3:21 PM ET #8

    You guys bring up a good point about the juice. I may have to adjust the unit size tomorrow in order to continue the system...

    Thanks for the comments!
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    You guys bring up a good point about the juice. I may have to adjust the unit size tomorrow in order to continue the system...

    Thanks for the comments!
     
    KissAPistol
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 3:50 PM ET #9

    Just a suggestion.  If you are willing to spend that much juice, maybe a 7 game chase ATS on those teams/situations might be a better choice.  Even in the event of a loss, you are still only losing roughly half of what you would likely lose on a 3 game ML chase.
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    Just a suggestion.  If you are willing to spend that much juice, maybe a 7 game chase ATS on those teams/situations might be a better choice.  Even in the event of a loss, you are still only losing roughly half of what you would likely lose on a 3 game ML chase.
     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 4:21 PM ET #10

    Thanks KAP -

    Will try to backtest that tonight! Great idea.


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    Thanks KAP -

    Will try to backtest that tonight! Great idea.


     
    MontanaMax
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 5:52 PM ET #11

    Yeah dude chasing steep ML's is nuts
    How about fading your own system and chasing dog ML's maybe
    Just an idea


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    Yeah dude chasing steep ML's is nuts
    How about fading your own system and chasing dog ML's maybe
    Just an idea


     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 6:02 PM ET #12

    hmmm....
    fading the Top 5 / Bottom 5?

    The juice would certainly be watered down and easier to handle. Perhaps instead of the Top 5 / Bottom 5 you play the middle 5-10 teams so that you are guaranteed more parity.

    Interesting.
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    hmmm....
    fading the Top 5 / Bottom 5?

    The juice would certainly be watered down and easier to handle. Perhaps instead of the Top 5 / Bottom 5 you play the middle 5-10 teams so that you are guaranteed more parity.

    Interesting.
     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 7:57 PM ET #13

    KAP's suggestion of a 7 chase ATS is worth checking out further. After some initial research, the wins and losses appear a bit streaky. This is still a very likeable strategy, and I like it. It needs some filters tho... Don't know what yet.

    And if this Top 5 / Bottom 5 trial fails, YOU KNOW I'll be fading it, Montana. THAT would be the ultimate system... find one that fails massively and fade it. Which brings me to an interesting Philosophical/Handicapping thought...

    ... Is it possible to create a strategy/system that fails at least 60% of the time? Can that system be inverted so that the fade works?

    GL tonight on all your picks!






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    KAP's suggestion of a 7 chase ATS is worth checking out further. After some initial research, the wins and losses appear a bit streaky. This is still a very likeable strategy, and I like it. It needs some filters tho... Don't know what yet.

    And if this Top 5 / Bottom 5 trial fails, YOU KNOW I'll be fading it, Montana. THAT would be the ultimate system... find one that fails massively and fade it. Which brings me to an interesting Philosophical/Handicapping thought...

    ... Is it possible to create a strategy/system that fails at least 60% of the time? Can that system be inverted so that the fade works?

    GL tonight on all your picks!






     
    MontanaMax
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 9:00 PM ET #14

    This is what its all man  

    After all somebody created the peanut butter jelly sandwich
    And now look at it

    One way or another with how sloppy the NBA is I'm sure the right dog  ATS or ML chase system along with a wise MM strategy can be profitable

       Keep it up - MegaMan

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    This is what its all man  

    After all somebody created the peanut butter jelly sandwich
    And now look at it

    One way or another with how sloppy the NBA is I'm sure the right dog  ATS or ML chase system along with a wise MM strategy can be profitable

       Keep it up - MegaMan

     
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 28, 2009 - 10:45 PM ET #15


    BOS - W
    SA - W
    ORL - W
    OKC (to beat SAC) - W

    +3 units on the season.

    no plays for tomorrow, 4 plays on Friday.




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    BOS - W
    SA - W
    ORL - W
    OKC (to beat SAC) - W

    +3 units on the season.

    no plays for tomorrow, 4 plays on Friday.




     
    nolemonasses
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    Posted: Oct. 29, 2009 - 10:02 AM ET #16

    I took OKC and bought the line down 3 points @-180. I felt that this was much better than the ML @ -300. I figured OKC was not only gonna win, but win by more than 3.5 points.

    So, when you have a huge ML, it might be better to buy the line down 3 points and only pay -170 or -180 instead of -200 to -1000.

    I will go back and look at your other wins from last night to see what would have happened.

     

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    I took OKC and bought the line down 3 points @-180. I felt that this was much better than the ML @ -300. I figured OKC was not only gonna win, but win by more than 3.5 points.

    So, when you have a huge ML, it might be better to buy the line down 3 points and only pay -170 or -180 instead of -200 to -1000.

    I will go back and look at your other wins from last night to see what would have happened.

     

     
    nolemonasses
    nolemonasses
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    Posted: Oct. 29, 2009 - 10:08 AM ET #17

    Now I know hindsight is 20/20, but all of the games you had last night covered the spread, which means buying the line down 3 points also won for all 4 games.

    So, something to think about. Maybe just play the spread, and buy down 3 points where you feel it would help. As mentioned above, a loss at -110 to -180 is a lot better than one at -200 and higher.

    When you did your research, you looked at the outright winners in your scenario. Did you look at the winners vs. the spread too? If so, I wonder how the 3 points would then reduce losses against the spread.

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    Now I know hindsight is 20/20, but all of the games you had last night covered the spread, which means buying the line down 3 points also won for all 4 games.

    So, something to think about. Maybe just play the spread, and buy down 3 points where you feel it would help. As mentioned above, a loss at -110 to -180 is a lot better than one at -200 and higher.

    When you did your research, you looked at the outright winners in your scenario. Did you look at the winners vs. the spread too? If so, I wonder how the 3 points would then reduce losses against the spread.

     
    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 29, 2009 - 10:22 AM ET #18


    Yeah, I thought of doing that. Good point. Here's the wins from last night and how much they beat the spread by.
    (source: Covers).

    ORL beat the spread by 4
    BOS beat the spread by 23
    OKC beat the spread by 6.5
    SA beat the spread by 7.5

    I think OKC is gonna surprise some people this year. They won't be great, but I see them winning around 40 or more games.
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    Yeah, I thought of doing that. Good point. Here's the wins from last night and how much they beat the spread by.
    (source: Covers).

    ORL beat the spread by 4
    BOS beat the spread by 23
    OKC beat the spread by 6.5
    SA beat the spread by 7.5

    I think OKC is gonna surprise some people this year. They won't be great, but I see them winning around 40 or more games.
     
    MontanaMax
    MontanaMax
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    Posted: Oct. 29, 2009 - 7:01 PM ET #19

    ............
    ............
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    ............
    ............
     
    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 30, 2009 - 12:31 PM ET #20


    Today's picks

    A - LAL
    A - BOS
    A - SAC to lose in NO
    A - MIL to lose in PHI

    All ML plays. If the juice is too high for you, try nolemonasses great suggestion of playing down 3 pts.

    GL to everyone on all your plays!






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    Today's picks

    A - LAL
    A - BOS
    A - SAC to lose in NO
    A - MIL to lose in PHI

    All ML plays. If the juice is too high for you, try nolemonasses great suggestion of playing down 3 pts.

    GL to everyone on all your plays!






     
    KMang
    KMang
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    Posts: 141
    Posted: Oct. 30, 2009 - 2:00 PM ET #21

    I am curious about another way to play this....  Instead of buying the 3 points per game, do you think that the system would be successful if you teased the games down 10 points each??

    I was toying with the idea of taking LAL, BOS, NO, and PHI tonight all teased down 10 points.  Or you could simply parlay BOS and LAL with PHI in one parlay and NO in another and that should be profitable as well.  The rare times that the elite teams lose at home, you get smoked, but betting them as parlays or teasers, at least you don't get smoked on a -900 ML. 

    Just a thought here....would appreciate any feedback.

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    I am curious about another way to play this....  Instead of buying the 3 points per game, do you think that the system would be successful if you teased the games down 10 points each??

    I was toying with the idea of taking LAL, BOS, NO, and PHI tonight all teased down 10 points.  Or you could simply parlay BOS and LAL with PHI in one parlay and NO in another and that should be profitable as well.  The rare times that the elite teams lose at home, you get smoked, but betting them as parlays or teasers, at least you don't get smoked on a -900 ML. 

    Just a thought here....would appreciate any feedback.

     
    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 30, 2009 - 2:31 PM ET #22

    Yes, high juice here.

    I'm not particularly fond of parlays. Although, if parlays are your thing, these are probably some good games to start with. I assembled these teams and games into this system based upon their high probability of winning and losing compounded by home and away schedules.

    Throughout the season, I'll check the spreadsheet to see if patterns develop though, which might support parlay play. Until then, it's straight ML for me.

    Thanks for the comments and suggestions!
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    Yes, high juice here.

    I'm not particularly fond of parlays. Although, if parlays are your thing, these are probably some good games to start with. I assembled these teams and games into this system based upon their high probability of winning and losing compounded by home and away schedules.

    Throughout the season, I'll check the spreadsheet to see if patterns develop though, which might support parlay play. Until then, it's straight ML for me.

    Thanks for the comments and suggestions!
     
    nolemonasses
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    Posted: Oct. 30, 2009 - 3:32 PM ET #23

    Kmang, i liked the parlay idea, but my book will not give a ML on Boston or NO. I guess they don't like their chances on those games at the ML.

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    Kmang, i liked the parlay idea, but my book will not give a ML on Boston or NO. I guess they don't like their chances on those games at the ML.

     
    MontanaMax
    MontanaMax
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    Posted: Oct. 30, 2009 - 9:54 PM ET #24

    Quote Originally Posted by KMang:

    I am curious about another way to play this....  Instead of buying the 3 points per game, do you think that the system would be successful if you teased the games down 10 points each??

    I was toying with the idea of taking LAL, BOS, NO, and PHI tonight all teased down 10 points.  Or you could simply parlay BOS and LAL with PHI in one parlay and NO in another and that should be profitable as well.  The rare times that the elite teams lose at home, you get smoked, but betting them as parlays or teasers, at least you don't get smoked on a -900 ML. 

    Just a thought here....would appreciate any feedback.




    Good idea but we're talking the NBA here
    "I love this slop"............ hahaha........
    Though it would help saving high juice on a loss
    But that one loss will kill the whole teaser or parlay while the rest win
    Shit happens
    To put some substance with my answer is that with MegaMan's    system here..............
    The right back testing......... to provide how strong it can be
    MM tactics.............   to save or make up on losses  (meaning some sort of modified Labby chase on a loss spread over the how many games or so)
    and commitment long term
    I think we all can eat real good when the season ends
    No more dollar menu - ahahahaha..........

    .............. JohnnyCakes
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    Quote Originally Posted by KMang:

    I am curious about another way to play this....  Instead of buying the 3 points per game, do you think that the system would be successful if you teased the games down 10 points each??

    I was toying with the idea of taking LAL, BOS, NO, and PHI tonight all teased down 10 points.  Or you could simply parlay BOS and LAL with PHI in one parlay and NO in another and that should be profitable as well.  The rare times that the elite teams lose at home, you get smoked, but betting them as parlays or teasers, at least you don't get smoked on a -900 ML. 

    Just a thought here....would appreciate any feedback.




    Good idea but we're talking the NBA here
    "I love this slop"............ hahaha........
    Though it would help saving high juice on a loss
    But that one loss will kill the whole teaser or parlay while the rest win
    Shit happens
    To put some substance with my answer is that with MegaMan's    system here..............
    The right back testing......... to provide how strong it can be
    MM tactics.............   to save or make up on losses  (meaning some sort of modified Labby chase on a loss spread over the how many games or so)
    and commitment long term
    I think we all can eat real good when the season ends
    No more dollar menu - ahahahaha..........

    .............. JohnnyCakes
     
     
    jonnymega
    jonnymega
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    Posted: Oct. 31, 2009 - 2:59 AM ET #25

    Really, Lakers?
    Grrrr.

    LAL - L
    BOS - W
    SAC to lose in NO - W
    MIL to lose in PH I- W

    +2 units on the season

    8-2 A bets
    0-0 B Chases
    0-0 C Chases

    CLE B bet tomorrow

    2009 NBA Top 5 / Bottom 5 spreadsheet




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    Really, Lakers?
    Grrrr.

    LAL - L
    BOS - W
    SAC to lose in NO - W
    MIL to lose in PH I- W

    +2 units on the season

    8-2 A bets
    0-0 B Chases
    0-0 C Chases

    CLE B bet tomorrow

    2009 NBA Top 5 / Bottom 5 spreadsheet




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