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If Christ died on the cross for all of humanity

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Mikniks

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:30 AM ET #3326

Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:

No silly! They can do whatever they want as long as they ask for forgiveness!

Oops I forgot!! Lol

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offensivestr

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:32 AM ET #3327

Yes neurons fire and unexplained things happen when you are close to death. You don't get to go meet someone that you've never seen or met that's been dead for thirty years.

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Mikniks

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:37 AM ET #3328

Quote Originally Posted by offensivestr:

Yes neurons fire and unexplained things happen when you are close to death. You don't get to go meet someone that you've never seen or met that's been dead for thirty years.

So you take her word that she's never seen a picture before in her entire life? A bit gullible I'd say...

Just because we don't yet understand what happens diring a NDE doesn't mean anything.

If we find a scientific cause for NDEs would you change your stance on things? Because it seems you've based your faith on what you can't explain...

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offensivestr

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:41 AM ET #3329

Same thing happened to a four year old boy that had his sister introduce herself to him in heaven. After waking up from near death surgery he asked his parents if he had a sister. When they said no he told them that he did. They were a little shocked considering they had never told him they had a baby that died at birth.

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offensivestr

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:45 AM ET #3330

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

So you take her word that she's never seen a picture before in her entire life? A bit gullible I'd say...

Just because we don't yet understand what happens diring a NDE doesn't mean anything.

If we find a scientific cause for NDEs would you change your stance on things? Because it seems you've based your faith on what you can't explain...

No they had just got married and he didn't like talking about her death.

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offensivestr

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:48 AM ET #3331

Story after story. Then you got this book explaining it all. I don't know what to tell you atheists. Goodnight,

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Mikniks

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 5:49 AM ET #3332

So why don't NDEs happen to everyone? God only wants to talk to a few people. He's not very chatty I guess...

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Rostos

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 8:28 AM ET #3333

Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:

I wonder if he knows how little of the brain humans use and how much of how the brain works we don't yet understand? Who knows what kind of neurons spark into action when teetering on the brink of life and death. But as we know, anything unexplained MUST be god...right?

Right, and when the body is clinically dead, it is ALL DEAD, BRAINS ARE NOT FUNCTIONING.......IF BRAINS ARE NOT FUNCTIONING, then how are they dreaming?

Oh, wait a second, i should have known, KK and co are smarter and know more than the brain surgeon who operated on her and said at the very end "i have no scientific explanation"....

Instead of you saying, well, its possible, you say, oh oh, if we dont dont know what it is , then why should we say its God? Well, of course not, but what if it is, at the very least, you should be saying, well its possible......

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Rostos

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 8:45 AM ET #3334

Let me share a story with you guys, take it for what is worth.

My father, was on the way to the airport.....My father is a real "blokes bloke" or a real "mans man", meaning he doesnt pull any punches, he tells it to you how it is, he isnt interested in bulls##t stories, he is the more "tough guy"....

Anyways, about 2-3 years ago on the way to the airport, he had a minor accident, his words were that on the impact of the collision, he felt, and saw 2 baby sized angels hold him back in his seat.

It was a very minor accident, he didnt even bump his head anywhere, he wasnt even taken to hospital, he definitly said 2 baby angels held him back in his seat at the moment of collision.

He never told neither my mum or me until about 2 years after it happened, why he held it from us, i dont know why, but he did. He absolutely swears by it. I suppose it is hard for you to understand the gravity of this as none of you know my dad and what he is like, but the thing is, the way my dad is as explained, a real mans man meaning he is the tough type etc etc and doesnt like having these conversations at all. THere was absolutely no reason for him to lie about this, none, he isnt interested in things like this.

Again, take it for what its worth, but dare i say if any of you ever met him, you would realise he was speaking the truth...again, i cant describe it, it is difficult to put in words....

Now you may ask why it happened to him and not everyone....... i will say i dont know and i have no clue, but it also may mean God works in mysterious ways, no pattern which is very possible, i dont know...

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matt4000

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 8:48 AM ET #3335

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

You mention you try not to be selfish, but by definition, many christians are selfish. Most christians do what they're told to get into heaven, so essentially they are only looking out for themselves...

I'm not saying ALL christians are this way. I'm sure there are some who just genuinely want to be good people, but if christians were told there is no heaven, I'm sure many would no longer take part in the religion. At the core, most people are selfish, and religions based on rewards feed on this selfishness. Quite genius really...

Totally agree!!!

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matt4000

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 8:50 AM ET #3336

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

So you believe there would be no morals today if not for religion? You think people wouldn't have thought, "Maybe we shouldn't kill each other." or "Maybe we shouldn't take other people's crap."? I promise we would have figured it out without religion...

Agree with this as well...But I do believe that religion usually helps put good morals into people's lives!

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matt4000

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 9:05 AM ET #3337

Quote Originally Posted by jagerfury:

Here you are pontificating from on high. How do you know all these things you claim? You haven't even proven the existence of a god, how can you nail down specifics of her temperament? Once again, you do not possess any special knowledge, or power not available to me, or anyone else.

Your list is nothing but speculation. Believe what you want, but you haven't proven anything except your willingness to believe pure myth.

My list is far from speculation, nor am I speaking in arrogance or claim to have any types of special knowledge or power.

I am simply in agreement with the other 1.5 billion Evangelical Christians throughout the world, that happens to be the 1 sharing these truths with you!

Also, I am in agreement with thousands of scholars and other believers from major universities that teach and share the same things that I am!

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matt4000

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 9:10 AM ET #3338

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

Oops I forgot!! Lol

That statement is the furthest thing from the truth.

I frankly don't know any authentic Christian that does this or believes this way.

I also do not know anywhere in the Bible where God teaches this type of practice.

As a matter of fact, Jesus teaches that that we all will be judged by thoughts and attitudes of our hearts.

So, if anyone thinks that they are TRULY forgiven, by just doing whatever they want, then ask for forgiveness and think that they are really forgiven...they are DECEIVED!!!

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matt4000

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Posted: Dec. 25, 2011 - 9:22 AM ET #3339

Further proofs of the existence of Jesus, outside of the Bible and not written by Christians, but written by secular writers.

Plinius Secundus, Pliny The Younger - Governor of Bithynia in Asia Minor (A.D. 112),

Pliny was writing the emperor Trajan seeking counsel as to how to treat the Christians. He explained that he had been killing both men and women, boys and girls. There were so many being put to death that he wondered if he should continue killing anyone who was discovered to be a Christian, or if he should kill only certain ones.

He explained that he had made the Christians bow down to the statues of Trajan. He goes on to say that he also "made them curse Christ, which a genuine Christian cannot be induced to do." In the same letter he says of the people who were being tried:

"They affirmed, however, that the whole of their guilt, or their error, was that they were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verse a hymn to Christ as to a God, and bound themselves to a solemn oath, not to do any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft, adultery, never to falsify their word, not to deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up (Epistles, X. 96).

Suetonius (A.D. 120) - A Roman historian, a court official under Hadrian, annalist of the Imperial House, Suetonius says: "As the person were making constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus [another spelling of Christus], he expelled them from Rome" (Life of Claudius, 25. 4). He also writes: "Punishment by Nero was inflicted on the Christians, a class of men given to a new and mischievous superstition" (Lives of the Caesars, 26. 2)

Tertullian (Regarding Pilate and Tiberius) - Jurist-theologian of Carthage, in a defense of Christianity (A.D. 197) before the Roman authorities in Africa, mentions the exchange between Tiberius and Pontius Pilate:

"Tiberius accordingly, in whose days the Christian name made its entry into the world, having himself received intelligence from the truth of Christ's divinity, brought the matter before the senate, with his own decision in favor of Christ. The senate, because it had not given the approval itself, rejected his proposal. Caesar held to his opinion, threatening wrath against all the accusers of the Christians (Apology, V.2).

Thallus, the Samaritan-born historian

One of the first Gentile writers who mentions Christ is Thallus, who wrote in A.D. 52. However, his writings have disappeared and we only know of them from fragments cited by other writers.

One such writer is Julius Africanus, a Christian writer about A.D. 221. One very interesting passage relates to a comment from Thallus. Julius Africanus writes: "Thallus in the third book of his histories, explains away this darkness as an eclipse of the sun- unreasonably, as it seems to me" (unreasonably, of course, because a solar eclipse could not take place at the time of the full moon, and it was the season of the Paschal full moon that Christ died).

Thus from this reference we see that the Gospel account of the darkness that fell upon the land during Christ's crucifixion was well-known and required a naturalistic explanation from those non-believers who witnessed it. 10/113

Phlegon, a first century historian

He is also mentioned by Julius Africanus, and quotes Phlegon that "during the time of Tiberius Caesar an eclipse of the sun occurred during the full moon". 60/n.p.

Phlegon is also mentioned by Origen in Contra Celsum, Book 2, sections 14, 33, 59. "And about this darkness..." He says that "Phlegon mentioned the eclipse which took place during the crucifixion of the Lord Jesus Christ, and no other [eclipse], it is clear he did not know from his sources about any [similar] eclipse in previous times... and this is shown by the historical account itself of Tiberius Caesar."

The Letter of Mara Bar-Serapion

It is in the British Museum. A manuscript preserving the text of a letter written around A.D.73. This letter was sent by a Syrian named Mara Bar-Serapion to his son Serapion. He instances the deaths of Socrates, Pythagoras and Christ.

"What advantage did the Athenians gain from putting Socrates to death? Famine and plague came upon them as a judgment for their crime. What advantage did the men of Samos gain from burning Pythagoras? In a moment their land was covered with sand. What advantage did the person gain from executing their wise King?

It was just after that their kingdom was abolished. God avenged these three wise men: the Athenians died of hunger; the Samians were overwhelmed by the sea; the person, ruined and driven from their land, live in complete dispersion. But Socrates did not die for good; he lived on in the teaching of Plato. Pythagoras did not die for good; he lived on in the statue of Hera. Nor did the wise king die for good; He lived on in the teaching which He had given. 10/114

All these historians and non-Christian people wrote about Christ and some of the unexplainable events that took place during His walk on earth. I don’t know how much more written proof one would need to be convinced the Gospels speak the truth.