ok. there's supernatural creator(s)! (not really)
got any evidence for yours?
didn't think so...
'A' god could exist... how could I possibly state anything for sure..?
there isn't any evidence for these magical beings you speak of... nor is there any for the one(s) you worship..
I've made no claim... you have... and have nothing to back it up.
Read post 1573...
The relaity is atheists have taken a bigger leap of faith than theists....
'A' god could exist... how could I possibly state anything for sure..?
there isn't any evidence for these magical beings you speak of... nor is there any for the one(s) you worship..
I've made no claim... you have... and have nothing to back it up.
Read post 1573...
The relaity is atheists have taken a bigger leap of faith than theists....
It is ONLY refuted because the people against it CLAIM there is actually a loos or a sunk cost associated with a belief, ie, time for church, donations, sacrificing ones own desires for God etc etc. These are the claims as to why it fails.
These sunk costs are an illusion.
At worst, visiting church even though i truely believe in God is a great hour for peace, quiet, meditative prayers and a sense of cleansing.......Factors which certainly make you feel good.
Therefore the refutations for Pascals wager are very poor.
It is ONLY refuted because the people against it CLAIM there is actually a loos or a sunk cost associated with a belief, ie, time for church, donations, sacrificing ones own desires for God etc etc. These are the claims as to why it fails.
These sunk costs are an illusion.
At worst, visiting church even though i truely believe in God is a great hour for peace, quiet, meditative prayers and a sense of cleansing.......Factors which certainly make you feel good.
Therefore the refutations for Pascals wager are very poor.
ok. there's supernatural creator(s)! (not really)
got any evidence for yours?
didn't think so...
Read post 1573, while it doesnt prove the Christian God, it certainly deems atheism to be false.
With arguments along with the Cosmological argument points to a very very powerful case for the Christian God
ok. there's supernatural creator(s)! (not really)
got any evidence for yours?
didn't think so...
Read post 1573, while it doesnt prove the Christian God, it certainly deems atheism to be false.
With arguments along with the Cosmological argument points to a very very powerful case for the Christian God
Read post 1573, while it doesnt prove the Christian God, it certainly deems atheism to be false.
atheism is not a belief dumb ass
With arguments along with the Cosmological argument points to a very very powerful case for the Christian God
Read post 1573, while it doesnt prove the Christian God, it certainly deems atheism to be false.
atheism is not a belief dumb ass
With arguments along with the Cosmological argument points to a very very powerful case for the Christian God
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
If atheism is not a belief system, then an atheist can prove beyond doubt that God doesnt exist. Can you do that?
I never said it can be proven. I simply sighted very poweful sign posts. Essentially, faith covers the shortfall between evidence and belief.
And I'm just curious Rostos... Let's say, hypothetically of course, that I wanted to live a christian life and attempt to repent for my sins, but I can't bring myself to believe in what I'm doing and all I can do is fake it... Does this count?... If not, how is it fair that god gave me a brain that doesn't allow me logically to believe in him... Then what? I go to hell because he gave me a brain that won't allow me to believe?? Or is faking it okay??
When questions are asked in relation to judgement, no one is in a position to answer that. No one, because we arent the judge..
I never said it can be proven. I simply sighted very poweful sign posts. Essentially, faith covers the shortfall between evidence and belief.
And I'm just curious Rostos... Let's say, hypothetically of course, that I wanted to live a christian life and attempt to repent for my sins, but I can't bring myself to believe in what I'm doing and all I can do is fake it... Does this count?... If not, how is it fair that god gave me a brain that doesn't allow me logically to believe in him... Then what? I go to hell because he gave me a brain that won't allow me to believe?? Or is faking it okay??
When questions are asked in relation to judgement, no one is in a position to answer that. No one, because we arent the judge..
Is it possible God caused the universe to come into existence?
yes or no?
Is it possible God caused the universe to come into existence?
yes or no?
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
An infinitily powerful , loving creator of the universe?
An infinitily powerful , loving creator of the universe?
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
This is the main issue, we are not the judge, therefore i cannot say who goes to heavan or who goes to hell. We arent the judge.
For all that i know, you could go to heavan, System could go to heavan, i really DONT KNOW, no one knows.
I just know, love God with all your heart, admit that i am a sinner, do my best not to sin and believe in Christ for his salvation.
Thats all you can do.
Btw, this is just my opinion, but i believe every single human being KNOWS deep down there is a God, for as the bible says we are without excuse. I firmly believe every single person knows deep down God exists, however, for a multitude of reasons, they deny it, reasons everything from themselves not wanting to be told what to do, what is right, what is wrong, man cannot stand that something is more supreme than they are, desire to sin, not happy with there life, emotional reasons, man thinking he is the smartest being, money is there God etc etc. A litany of reasons in my view why man supresses the truth.
Anyways, that is my opinion.....
drake nice post but there is strong belief john who wrote revelation(we think he wrote not totally acsertained it was disciple john) exiled a normal death on a greek island
Yes, I know that John died a natural death, that's why I said most of them were crucified in my last post. Let me just go through all of them with a brief description and in the manner on how they died.
Andrew was the brother of Peter, and a son of Jonas. He lived in Bethsaida and Capernaum and was a fisherman before he was called by Jesus. He died a martyr. He was crucified, but feeling unworthy to be crucified on the same-shaped cross as his Master, begged that his be different. So, he was crucified on an X-shaped cross, which is still called Saint Andrew's cross and which is one of his apostolic symbols.
Bartholomew Nathanael, son of Talmai, lived in Cana of Galilee. He was a missionary in Armenia. He died a martyr. He was flayed alive with knives. His apostolic symbol is three parallel knives.
James, the Elder, Boanerges, son of Zebedee and Salome, brother of John the Apostle; a fisherman who lived in Bethsaida, Capernaum, and Jerusalem. He died a martyr. He was beheaded by Herold, A.D. 44. His symbol is three shells, the sign of his pilgrimage by the sea.
James, the Lesser or Younger, son of Alphaeus and Mary, lived in Galilee. He was the brother of the Apostle Jude. He preached in Palestine and Egypt and was crucified in Egypt. He died as a martyr and his body was sawed in pieces. The saw became his apostolic symbol.
John Boanerges, son of Zebedee and Salome, brother of James, the apostle, was known as the Beloved Disciple. A fisherman who lived in Bethsaida, Capernaum, and Jerusalem. He was banished to the Isle of Patmos, he was later freed and died a natural death. It is said an attempt was made on his life by giving him a chalice of poison from which God spared him. He died of natural causes. A chalice with a snake in it is his symbol.
Judas Iscariot, the traitor was the son of Simon who lived in Kerioth of Judah. He betrayed Jesus for thirty pieces of silver and afterwards hanged himself (Matt. 26:14,16). His apostolic symbol is a hangman's noose or a money purse with pieces of silver falling from it.
Jude, Thaddaeus, son of Alphaeus and Mary. He was a brother of James the Younger. He lived in Galilee. He preached in Assyria and Persia and died a martyr in Persia. He was killed with arrows at Ararat. The chosen symbol for him is the ship because he was a missionary thought to be a fisherman.
Matthew, or Levi, son of Alphaeus, lived in Capernaum. He was a publican or tax collector. He died a martyr in Ethiopia. The apostolic symbol of Matthew is three money bags which remind us that he was a tax collector before Jesus called him.
Peter, Simon Peter, son of Jonas, was a fisherman who lived in Bethsaida and Capernaum. Peter was martyred on the cross. He requested that he might be crucified head downward for he was not worthy to die as his Lord had died. His apostolic symbol is a cross upside down with crossed keys. The keys represent Peter as holder of the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven.
Philip, tradition says that Philip preached in Phrygia and died a martyr at Hierapolis. Philip came from Bethsaida, the town from which Peter and Andrew came from. The likelihood is that he, too, was a fisherman. He died by hanging. While he was dying, he requested that his body be wrapped not in linen but in papyrus for he was not worthy than even his dead body should be treated as the body of Jesus had been treated. The symbol of Philip is a basket, because of his part in the feeding of the five thousand. It is he that stressed the cross as a sign of Christianity and victory.
Simon, the Zealot, one of the little-known followers called the Canaanite or Zelotes, lived in Galilee. Tradition says he was crucified and died as a martyr. His apostolic symbol is a fish lying on a Bible, which indicated he was a former fisherman who became a fisher of men through preaching.
Thomas Didymus lived in Galilee. Tradition says he labored in Parthia, Persia, and India, suffering martyrdom near Madaras, at Mt. St. Thomas, India. It is said that he was commissioned to build a palace for the king of India, and he was killed with a spear as a martyr for his Lord. His symbol is a group of spears, stone, and arrows.
So we see here that ten of Jesus disciples died as martyrs for the truth they all knew. John died from natural causes, and Judas hanged himself, feeling guilty for betraying Jesus would be the likely reason.
These disciples or apostles of Christ were the foundation stones of His Church. In Rev. 21:14 we are told that the twelve foundations of the wall of the new Jerusalem will have in them the names of the twelve apostles. It is evident, therefore, that our Lord attaches great importance to these men.
drake nice post but there is strong belief john who wrote revelation(we think he wrote not totally acsertained it was disciple john) exiled a normal death on a greek island
Yes, I know that John died a natural death, that's why I said most of them were crucified in my last post. Let me just go through all of them with a brief description and in the manner on how they died.
Andrew was the brother of Peter, and a son of Jonas. He lived in Bethsaida and Capernaum and was a fisherman before he was called by Jesus. He died a martyr. He was crucified, but feeling unworthy to be crucified on the same-shaped cross as his Master, begged that his be different. So, he was crucified on an X-shaped cross, which is still called Saint Andrew's cross and which is one of his apostolic symbols.
Bartholomew Nathanael, son of Talmai, lived in Cana of Galilee. He was a missionary in Armenia. He died a martyr. He was flayed alive with knives. His apostolic symbol is three parallel knives.
James, the Elder, Boanerges, son of Zebedee and Salome, brother of John the Apostle; a fisherman who lived in Bethsaida, Capernaum, and Jerusalem. He died a martyr. He was beheaded by Herold, A.D. 44. His symbol is three shells, the sign of his pilgrimage by the sea.
James, the Lesser or Younger, son of Alphaeus and Mary, lived in Galilee. He was the brother of the Apostle Jude. He preached in Palestine and Egypt and was crucified in Egypt. He died as a martyr and his body was sawed in pieces. The saw became his apostolic symbol.
John Boanerges, son of Zebedee and Salome, brother of James, the apostle, was known as the Beloved Disciple. A fisherman who lived in Bethsaida, Capernaum, and Jerusalem. He was banished to the Isle of Patmos, he was later freed and died a natural death. It is said an attempt was made on his life by giving him a chalice of poison from which God spared him. He died of natural causes. A chalice with a snake in it is his symbol.
Judas Iscariot, the traitor was the son of Simon who lived in Kerioth of Judah. He betrayed Jesus for thirty pieces of silver and afterwards hanged himself (Matt. 26:14,16). His apostolic symbol is a hangman's noose or a money purse with pieces of silver falling from it.
Jude, Thaddaeus, son of Alphaeus and Mary. He was a brother of James the Younger. He lived in Galilee. He preached in Assyria and Persia and died a martyr in Persia. He was killed with arrows at Ararat. The chosen symbol for him is the ship because he was a missionary thought to be a fisherman.
Matthew, or Levi, son of Alphaeus, lived in Capernaum. He was a publican or tax collector. He died a martyr in Ethiopia. The apostolic symbol of Matthew is three money bags which remind us that he was a tax collector before Jesus called him.
Peter, Simon Peter, son of Jonas, was a fisherman who lived in Bethsaida and Capernaum. Peter was martyred on the cross. He requested that he might be crucified head downward for he was not worthy to die as his Lord had died. His apostolic symbol is a cross upside down with crossed keys. The keys represent Peter as holder of the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven.
Philip, tradition says that Philip preached in Phrygia and died a martyr at Hierapolis. Philip came from Bethsaida, the town from which Peter and Andrew came from. The likelihood is that he, too, was a fisherman. He died by hanging. While he was dying, he requested that his body be wrapped not in linen but in papyrus for he was not worthy than even his dead body should be treated as the body of Jesus had been treated. The symbol of Philip is a basket, because of his part in the feeding of the five thousand. It is he that stressed the cross as a sign of Christianity and victory.
Simon, the Zealot, one of the little-known followers called the Canaanite or Zelotes, lived in Galilee. Tradition says he was crucified and died as a martyr. His apostolic symbol is a fish lying on a Bible, which indicated he was a former fisherman who became a fisher of men through preaching.
Thomas Didymus lived in Galilee. Tradition says he labored in Parthia, Persia, and India, suffering martyrdom near Madaras, at Mt. St. Thomas, India. It is said that he was commissioned to build a palace for the king of India, and he was killed with a spear as a martyr for his Lord. His symbol is a group of spears, stone, and arrows.
So we see here that ten of Jesus disciples died as martyrs for the truth they all knew. John died from natural causes, and Judas hanged himself, feeling guilty for betraying Jesus would be the likely reason.
These disciples or apostles of Christ were the foundation stones of His Church. In Rev. 21:14 we are told that the twelve foundations of the wall of the new Jerusalem will have in them the names of the twelve apostles. It is evident, therefore, that our Lord attaches great importance to these men.
You, just like anyone else dont have any empirical evidence of how the universe was created, God as one cause of the universe, cannot be empirically disproved, therefore, logically you have a "belief" that God doesnt exist, atheism is a belief system........
You, just like anyone else dont have any empirical evidence of how the universe was created, God as one cause of the universe, cannot be empirically disproved, therefore, logically you have a "belief" that God doesnt exist, atheism is a belief system........
How am i dodging the question? I am not being asked a simple question about a cort case, i am being asked about the mind of an infinitly powerful mind where my mind is extremely limited in comparison.
I dont know what is inside Mikniks heart and mind, how he has lived, how am i in a position to judge where he goes.
How am i dodging the question? I am not being asked a simple question about a cort case, i am being asked about the mind of an infinitly powerful mind where my mind is extremely limited in comparison.
I dont know what is inside Mikniks heart and mind, how he has lived, how am i in a position to judge where he goes.
IMO, i think its the opposite way around.....
IMO, i think its the opposite way around.....
How am i dodging the question? I am not being asked a simple question about a cort case, i am being asked about the mind of an infinitly powerful mind where my mind is extremely limited in comparison.
I dont know what is inside Mikniks heart and mind, how he has lived, how am i in a position to judge where he goes.
How am i dodging the question? I am not being asked a simple question about a cort case, i am being asked about the mind of an infinitly powerful mind where my mind is extremely limited in comparison.
I dont know what is inside Mikniks heart and mind, how he has lived, how am i in a position to judge where he goes.
We can't say what is fair and what is not, all I know is that God is just.
He the Creator makes the rules that we must abide by and not us. You just can't think in your terms.
and when you say your brain doesn't allow you to believe in Him...it just shows your stubborness and self-righteouness.
We can't say what is fair and what is not, all I know is that God is just.
He the Creator makes the rules that we must abide by and not us. You just can't think in your terms.
and when you say your brain doesn't allow you to believe in Him...it just shows your stubborness and self-righteouness.
You, just like anyone else dont have any empirical evidence of how the universe was created, God
You, just like anyone else dont have any empirical evidence of how the universe was created, God
I know one thing, God is fair and will judge righteously.
Maybe, just maybe Mikmiks based on what he says will go to heavan, i dont know, i am guessing, but i know that God is fair and will judge right, thats all i can say...
I know one thing, God is fair and will judge righteously.
Maybe, just maybe Mikmiks based on what he says will go to heavan, i dont know, i am guessing, but i know that God is fair and will judge right, thats all i can say...
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