supernaturally inspired by "god"?, please demonstrate how you know that. as far as I know, there is no way to test the "supernatural"...otherwise you're just making garbage up...
1500 years in the making, 40 different authors in 60 books all pointing to a massiah with no contradictions.
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Quote Originally Posted by SYSTEM:
supernaturally inspired by "god"?, please demonstrate how you know that. as far as I know, there is no way to test the "supernatural"...otherwise you're just making garbage up...
1500 years in the making, 40 different authors in 60 books all pointing to a massiah with no contradictions.
I am not trying to be nasty here, but your answer is typical with a lotof atheists and it shows the caricature many atheists have of God.
The issue is one of free will. Your argument resembles something that if God did exist to you, he would be some sort of super hero rescuing people in there daily lives like a Batman or a Superman.
God gave us all free will and the bi product of that free will is that people use it for evil.
Why doesnt God intervene? Consider this.
Under Christianity, God considers ANY form of sex OUTSIDE of marriage to be a sin. That is, God frowns upon all sex outside marriage.
Now, what logic is it where an atheist asks where was God when a child was about to be raped? However, look at it from Gods perspective, remember he frowns upon ANY sex outside marriage, including homosexuality, consenting adult male/female etc etc. So why do you want God to intervene in 1 case and not the other?
Essentially you are dictating to God what he should and shouldnt do. You then might say, well consenting sex between 2 adults isnt causing any problems. Well according to God is does, the point is God frowns upon it.
Essentially we all tell God to butt out when we dont want him or going to do something against his will but ask him to intervene when something bad is going to happen.
This has essentially created an image of God where he is a "genie" type character. Remember that show, i dream of genie?
First, I'm going to steal a quote from Epicurus:
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
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Quote Originally Posted by Rostos:
I am not trying to be nasty here, but your answer is typical with a lotof atheists and it shows the caricature many atheists have of God.
The issue is one of free will. Your argument resembles something that if God did exist to you, he would be some sort of super hero rescuing people in there daily lives like a Batman or a Superman.
God gave us all free will and the bi product of that free will is that people use it for evil.
Why doesnt God intervene? Consider this.
Under Christianity, God considers ANY form of sex OUTSIDE of marriage to be a sin. That is, God frowns upon all sex outside marriage.
Now, what logic is it where an atheist asks where was God when a child was about to be raped? However, look at it from Gods perspective, remember he frowns upon ANY sex outside marriage, including homosexuality, consenting adult male/female etc etc. So why do you want God to intervene in 1 case and not the other?
Essentially you are dictating to God what he should and shouldnt do. You then might say, well consenting sex between 2 adults isnt causing any problems. Well according to God is does, the point is God frowns upon it.
Essentially we all tell God to butt out when we dont want him or going to do something against his will but ask him to intervene when something bad is going to happen.
This has essentially created an image of God where he is a "genie" type character. Remember that show, i dream of genie?
First, I'm going to steal a quote from Epicurus:
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
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Quote Originally Posted by Ktrain:
First, I'm going to steal a quote from Epicurus:
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
free will? then why do people pray? if your god has a plan, then prayer would be useless, and if god has a plan and knows everything that will happen, then there is no free will
god doesn't intervene? you have to be kidding, right? better read the bible again...
by the way, you need evidence of god before you tell us what it all means and how it all works...but we know that will never happen...
you talking about logic is too funny, because the whole god idea is illogical...
Read up on Molinism....Middle knowledge
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Quote Originally Posted by SYSTEM:
free will? then why do people pray? if your god has a plan, then prayer would be useless, and if god has a plan and knows everything that will happen, then there is no free will
god doesn't intervene? you have to be kidding, right? better read the bible again...
by the way, you need evidence of god before you tell us what it all means and how it all works...but we know that will never happen...
you talking about logic is too funny, because the whole god idea is illogical...
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
You didnt answer my question or give me your views to my post. Instead you just gave me a quote which didnt address anything
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Quote Originally Posted by Ktrain:
First, I'm going to steal a quote from Epicurus:
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
You didnt answer my question or give me your views to my post. Instead you just gave me a quote which didnt address anything
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
If God prevented evil, then how will you know what good is? You cannot have good without evil. If God prevented sorrow, how will you know what joy is? Its the yin and yan sort of thing.
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Quote Originally Posted by Ktrain:
First, I'm going to steal a quote from Epicurus:
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
If God prevented evil, then how will you know what good is? You cannot have good without evil. If God prevented sorrow, how will you know what joy is? Its the yin and yan sort of thing.
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
You have free will in everything you do. Maybe you will come around and see the light, or maybe you won't. God knows but the choice is still yours.
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Quote Originally Posted by Ktrain:
Second, I think free will and a belief in God are contradictory. Either we have free will or we're living according to God's plan.
If I have free will, I can deviate from God's plan. If God has a plan, then I do not have free will....even if I think I do.
I'm interested in hearing your views on who qualifies for marriage according to God? Can a child, say 9 or 10 years old be married according to God? If so, would you be ok with that happening?
You have free will in everything you do. Maybe you will come around and see the light, or maybe you won't. God knows but the choice is still yours.
You , your soul, spirit was created ,thought of and planned for many many years ago. Your parents subsequently their parents gave room for you to exist. Before that your soul was created. Hence our body is temporary housing for your soul. Your soul is eternal it continues after your body perishes. God is good it is an unseen advocate for be it weaker positioned in short term position such as kindness love mercy. Long term security resides within these divine gifts.
0
You , your soul, spirit was created ,thought of and planned for many many years ago. Your parents subsequently their parents gave room for you to exist. Before that your soul was created. Hence our body is temporary housing for your soul. Your soul is eternal it continues after your body perishes. God is good it is an unseen advocate for be it weaker positioned in short term position such as kindness love mercy. Long term security resides within these divine gifts.
You , your soul, spirit was created ,thought of and planned for many many years ago. Your parents subsequently their parents gave room for you to exist. Before that your soul was created. Hence our body is temporary housing for your soul. Your soul is eternal it continues after your body perishes. God is good it is an unseen advocate for be it weaker positioned in short term position such as kindness love mercy. Long term security resides within these divine gifts.
You're making s h I t up...
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
You , your soul, spirit was created ,thought of and planned for many many years ago. Your parents subsequently their parents gave room for you to exist. Before that your soul was created. Hence our body is temporary housing for your soul. Your soul is eternal it continues after your body perishes. God is good it is an unseen advocate for be it weaker positioned in short term position such as kindness love mercy. Long term security resides within these divine gifts.
masonic final rights, with cedar boughs soul is eternal body temporal... source
other related sources , lord of hosts writing on the wall for he was in spirit and would be made flesh, daniel
john the babtist and jesus knew each other in the womb. as their mothers were cousins new testament, when the final birth is made he will be born dead and soulless for the valley of souls will be empty, revelations.
0
masonic final rights, with cedar boughs soul is eternal body temporal... source
other related sources , lord of hosts writing on the wall for he was in spirit and would be made flesh, daniel
john the babtist and jesus knew each other in the womb. as their mothers were cousins new testament, when the final birth is made he will be born dead and soulless for the valley of souls will be empty, revelations.
masonic final rights, with cedar boughs soul is eternal body temporal... source
other related sources , lord of hosts writing on the wall for he was in spirit and would be made flesh, daniel
john the babtist and jesus knew each other in the womb. as their mothers were cousins new testament, when the final birth is made he will be born dead and soulless for the valley of souls will be empty, revelations.
0
Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
masonic final rights, with cedar boughs soul is eternal body temporal... source
other related sources , lord of hosts writing on the wall for he was in spirit and would be made flesh, daniel
john the babtist and jesus knew each other in the womb. as their mothers were cousins new testament, when the final birth is made he will be born dead and soulless for the valley of souls will be empty, revelations.
atheist cause I can see a brain during surgery on history and medical shows,
preacher states great, so how does this mass of tissue Love, have empathy compassion and thought, how does it problem solve you cant see the process you cannot touch it ... five senses can not describe it yet it is.
0
atheist stated yes.
preacher how do you know
atheist cause I can see a brain during surgery on history and medical shows,
preacher states great, so how does this mass of tissue Love, have empathy compassion and thought, how does it problem solve you cant see the process you cannot touch it ... five senses can not describe it yet it is.
There is no hell or heaven. Everything just goes black and we turn into compost. Just like every other living creature on earth.
I can agree or bodies will be remade, take a tree it has leaves, the leaves grow turn color and fall from this point they were apart of the tree and now they are cast down the leaves then become to soil . at some point this organic material will be picked up by the tree or possibly a seed of the tree and return to being apart of the tree.
fine got it no problem with that.
now near death experiences Thousands of documents the same story. big light filled with warmth and acceptance drawing one to it, except there was some one or something that drew the soul back to the body. thousands of the same story from strangers in all different eras some a century apart in testimonies stating exactly the same thing.
however there are animals in heaven for a Samaritan ask jesus and he answered I am here to feed the children not the dogs, she stated if the children wont eat at your fathers table will you not give the scraps to the dogs? He stated only through the holy spirit would you know of such things.
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Quote Originally Posted by searchwarrant:
There is no hell or heaven. Everything just goes black and we turn into compost. Just like every other living creature on earth.
I can agree or bodies will be remade, take a tree it has leaves, the leaves grow turn color and fall from this point they were apart of the tree and now they are cast down the leaves then become to soil . at some point this organic material will be picked up by the tree or possibly a seed of the tree and return to being apart of the tree.
fine got it no problem with that.
now near death experiences Thousands of documents the same story. big light filled with warmth and acceptance drawing one to it, except there was some one or something that drew the soul back to the body. thousands of the same story from strangers in all different eras some a century apart in testimonies stating exactly the same thing.
however there are animals in heaven for a Samaritan ask jesus and he answered I am here to feed the children not the dogs, she stated if the children wont eat at your fathers table will you not give the scraps to the dogs? He stated only through the holy spirit would you know of such things.
atheist cause I can see a brain during surgery on history and medical shows,
preacher states great, so how does this mass of tissue Love, have empathy compassion and thought, how does it problem solve you cant see the process you cannot touch it ... five senses can not describe it yet it is.
love, empathy, and compassion are labels we put on the feeling we have and we can demonstrate love, empathy, and compassion...we know we have thought because we can demonstrate thinking...you cannot demonstrate a soul...and you cannot even define a soul. Ask 10 different people and you will get 10 different answers on what a should is...
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
atheist stated yes.
preacher how do you know
atheist cause I can see a brain during surgery on history and medical shows,
preacher states great, so how does this mass of tissue Love, have empathy compassion and thought, how does it problem solve you cant see the process you cannot touch it ... five senses can not describe it yet it is.
love, empathy, and compassion are labels we put on the feeling we have and we can demonstrate love, empathy, and compassion...we know we have thought because we can demonstrate thinking...you cannot demonstrate a soul...and you cannot even define a soul. Ask 10 different people and you will get 10 different answers on what a should is...
I can agree or bodies will be remade, take a tree it has leaves, the leaves grow turn color and fall from this point they were apart of the tree and now they are cast down the leaves then become to soil . at some point this organic material will be picked up by the tree or possibly a seed of the tree and return to being apart of the tree.
fine got it no problem with that.
now near death experiences Thousands of documents the same story. big light filled with warmth and acceptance drawing one to it, except there was some one or something that drew the soul back to the body. thousands of the same story from strangers in all different eras some a century apart in testimonies stating exactly the same thing.
If you look into near death experiences you will find that people report what they were raised to believe or what their beliefs were at the time. No hindu has come back from the dead and claimed he saw jesus.
"drew the soul back into the body"? You need to demonstrate there is such thing as a soul first...
as for a "big light", a lot of chemical reactions are happening in the brain at the moment it is about to die...plus most people have heard that story...
however there are animals in heaven for a Samaritan ask jesus and he answered I am here to feed the children not the dogs, she stated if the children wont eat at your fathers table will you not give the scraps to the dogs? He stated only through the holy spirit would you know of such things.
0
Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
I can agree or bodies will be remade, take a tree it has leaves, the leaves grow turn color and fall from this point they were apart of the tree and now they are cast down the leaves then become to soil . at some point this organic material will be picked up by the tree or possibly a seed of the tree and return to being apart of the tree.
fine got it no problem with that.
now near death experiences Thousands of documents the same story. big light filled with warmth and acceptance drawing one to it, except there was some one or something that drew the soul back to the body. thousands of the same story from strangers in all different eras some a century apart in testimonies stating exactly the same thing.
If you look into near death experiences you will find that people report what they were raised to believe or what their beliefs were at the time. No hindu has come back from the dead and claimed he saw jesus.
"drew the soul back into the body"? You need to demonstrate there is such thing as a soul first...
as for a "big light", a lot of chemical reactions are happening in the brain at the moment it is about to die...plus most people have heard that story...
however there are animals in heaven for a Samaritan ask jesus and he answered I am here to feed the children not the dogs, she stated if the children wont eat at your fathers table will you not give the scraps to the dogs? He stated only through the holy spirit would you know of such things.
I remember my mother when she was dyin', looked all shrunk up and gray. I asked her if she was afraid. She just shook her head. I was afraid to touch the death I seen in her. I couldn't find nothin' beautiful or uplifting about her goin' back to God. I heard of people talk about immortality, but I ain't seen it.
Private Witt: I wondered how it'd be like when I died, what it'd be like to know this breath now was the last one you was ever gonna draw. I just hope I can meet it the same way she did, with the same... calm. 'Cause that's where it's hidden - the immortality I hadn't seen.
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I remember my mother when she was dyin', looked all shrunk up and gray. I asked her if she was afraid. She just shook her head. I was afraid to touch the death I seen in her. I couldn't find nothin' beautiful or uplifting about her goin' back to God. I heard of people talk about immortality, but I ain't seen it.
Private Witt: I wondered how it'd be like when I died, what it'd be like to know this breath now was the last one you was ever gonna draw. I just hope I can meet it the same way she did, with the same... calm. 'Cause that's where it's hidden - the immortality I hadn't seen.
even princes... one prince left his kingdom to become a beggar
the rest is history.
heres the brief intro:
The story takes place in Nepalese plain land-Kapilvastu. Siddhartha decides to leave behind his home in the hope of gaining spiritual illumination by becoming an ascetic wandering beggar of the Shramanas.
Joined by his best friend Govinda, Siddhartha fasts, becomes homeless,
renounces all personal possessions, and intensely meditates, eventually
seeking and personally speaking with Gautama, the famous Buddha, or
Enlightened One. Afterward, both Siddhartha and Govinda acknowledge the
elegance of the Buddha's teachings. Although Govinda
hastily joins the Buddha's order, Siddhartha does not follow, claiming
that the Buddha's philosophy, though supremely wise, does not account
for the necessarily distinct experiences of each person. He argues that
the individual seeks an absolutely unique and personal meaning that
cannot be presented to him by a teacher. He thus resolves to carry on
his quest alone.
0
free will is awesome...
hitler had many chances...
even princes... one prince left his kingdom to become a beggar
the rest is history.
heres the brief intro:
The story takes place in Nepalese plain land-Kapilvastu. Siddhartha decides to leave behind his home in the hope of gaining spiritual illumination by becoming an ascetic wandering beggar of the Shramanas.
Joined by his best friend Govinda, Siddhartha fasts, becomes homeless,
renounces all personal possessions, and intensely meditates, eventually
seeking and personally speaking with Gautama, the famous Buddha, or
Enlightened One. Afterward, both Siddhartha and Govinda acknowledge the
elegance of the Buddha's teachings. Although Govinda
hastily joins the Buddha's order, Siddhartha does not follow, claiming
that the Buddha's philosophy, though supremely wise, does not account
for the necessarily distinct experiences of each person. He argues that
the individual seeks an absolutely unique and personal meaning that
cannot be presented to him by a teacher. He thus resolves to carry on
his quest alone.
so how do you explain Dr Mcdougals and others finding of the weight of the soul 21 grams...
MacDougall's results were flawed because the methodology used to harvest them was suspect, the sample size far too small, and the ability to measure changes in weight imprecise. For this reason, credence should not be given to the idea his experiments proved something, let alone that they measured the weight of the soul as 21 grams. His postulations on this topic are a curiosity, but nothing more.
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Quote Originally Posted by nature1970:
so how do you explain Dr Mcdougals and others finding of the weight of the soul 21 grams...
MacDougall's results were flawed because the methodology used to harvest them was suspect, the sample size far too small, and the ability to measure changes in weight imprecise. For this reason, credence should not be given to the idea his experiments proved something, let alone that they measured the weight of the soul as 21 grams. His postulations on this topic are a curiosity, but nothing more.
I believe in a creator I also believe all good people regardless of religion will go to heaven as Jesus stated their will be those who state what wonderful work they did in his name he will rebuke and those that ask might he be the lord he say he is.
if that deeply offends you systematic then I suggest take it up with god .... oh right.... your a atheist....
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I believe in a creator I also believe all good people regardless of religion will go to heaven as Jesus stated their will be those who state what wonderful work they did in his name he will rebuke and those that ask might he be the lord he say he is.
if that deeply offends you systematic then I suggest take it up with god .... oh right.... your a atheist....
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