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If Christ died on the cross for all of humanity

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Posted: #1801
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:



Yes I bet there has been!!!  This has nothing to do with the point being made!!!!  Stop thinking that refuting Santa Claus will somehow prove the existence of god!!

Now please provide at least a shred of evidence proving the existence of god...  Don't worry, I'll wait...


I think we live in the Matrix.  Prove me wrong...  You can't so I guess it's true...


See the point yet?!?


I say this respectfully  but what are your motives for posting in this thread? You are most certainly free to post whatever you want, whenever you want, however you want (within the rules of Covers, of course), and I understand that.  When Rostos, SJD, myself, and others started posting in this thread 2 months ago, we were posting (and obviously still are) because we honestly and humbly are trying to help people understand and grasp the answers to the questions they posed. To my knowledge, Rostos, SJD, etc have not once belittled or attacked anyone for saying anything that they did. 

My thing is that I am fine (and encourage) you and anybody else to pose questions, or make comments on what you believe. That is your right, and again, I encourage everybody to ask questions; because even if you do not believe and trust what we are saying, maybe somebody else who has the same question or comment as you do will believe. But attacking, verbally (in this case), a poster on here should not be part of this conversation. What is the point of that? In no way, shape, or form have any of us directly attacked you; so, in turn, why attack them? 

As far as the existence of God and most, if not all of your questions go, here is a link to the thread a created a little while after this thread started. I know there is a ton there, but I would like for you to read it all... because it answers most, if not all of your questions. It will take some time to read, but hopefully it will help.


I asked this in my thread, but I will ask it in here as well... Do you want there to be a God? If you say yes, you do want there to be a God, then there is plenty of factual, credible, and reliable proof that Christianity offers that will answer most, if not all of the questions you have.... On the other hand, if you do not want there to be a God, do you honestly think that there is anything that anybody can say that would change your mind? In the Bible, it says that there have been and always will be people that witness and glory of God, and witness the miracles of Jesus Christ, and yet still not believe. Even though they have the Truth before their very eyes, they still choose not to believe it. 

Anyways, please consider what I have said, and if you have any questions, please ask 
 
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Posted: #1802
And in reference to KCA, it is just another argument unsupported by evidence.  You claim to know the motives of why the universe came to be?  Interesting...

BUT I want you to attempt to disprove that we all live in a computer program, so please do address that...
 
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Posted: #1803
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:



I say this respectfully  but what are your motives for posting in this thread? You are most certainly free to post whatever you want, whenever you want, however you want (within the rules of Covers, of course), and I understand that.  When Rostos, SJD, myself, and others started posting in this thread 2 months ago, we were posting (and obviously still are) because we honestly and humbly are trying to help people understand and grasp the answers to the questions they posed. To my knowledge, Rostos, SJD, etc have not once belittled or attacked anyone for saying anything that they did. 

My thing is that I am fine (and encourage) you and anybody else to pose questions, or make comments on what you believe. That is your right, and again, I encourage everybody to ask questions; because even if you do not believe and trust what we are saying, maybe somebody else who has the same question or comment as you do will believe. But attacking, verbally (in this case), a poster on here should not be part of this conversation. What is the point of that? In no way, shape, or form have any of us directly attacked you; so, in turn, why attack them? 

As far as the existence of God and most, if not all of your questions go, here is a link to the thread a created a little while after this thread started. I know there is a ton there, but I would like for you to read it all... because it answers most, if not all of your questions. It will take some time to read, but hopefully it will help.


I asked this in my thread, but I will ask it in here as well... Do you want there to be a God? If you say yes, you do want there to be a God, then there is plenty of factual, credible, and reliable proof that Christianity offers that will answer most, if not all of the questions you have.... On the other hand, if you do not want there to be a God, do you honestly think that there is anything that anybody can say that would change your mind? In the Bible, it says that there have been and always will be people that witness and glory of God, and witness the miracles of Jesus Christ, and yet still not believe. Even though they have the Truth before their very eyes, they still choose not to believe it. 

Anyways, please consider what I have said, and if you have any questions, please ask 


Where in THAT post did I say anything that verbally attacked anyone?  Or was it because I used big bold letters??


Regardless, I've said it before in here, and I'll say it again: I WANT there to be a god, but I can't believe in something that has no evidence supporting it...  If you tell me unicorns are real, I won't believe you because there is no evidence...
 
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Posted: #1804
I quoted that comment because of the "existence of God" part. I provide plenty of evidence that shows God's existence, the proof that Jesus' miracles really did happen, and much much more. If you TRULY want there to be a God, then the answers are there bro 
 
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Posted: #1805
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:

I quoted that comment because of the "existence of God" part. I provide plenty of evidence that shows God's existence, the proof that Jesus' miracles really did happen, and much much more. If you TRULY want there to be a God, then the answers are there bro 



There is no evidence of god.  You also have no evidence that Jesus performed miracles.  All you know is that you read it in a book...

AND you can not use the bible as evidence of god BECAUSE you must first prove god exists before you can prove the validity of the bible...
 
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Posted: #1806
Don't worry Mikniks; while I do use the Bible some/often in my responses, I use other factual, credible reasons and answers as well. Although, I also showed, several times, how the Bible should be considered true and extremely credible, just strengthening the evidence even more. Just read what I have posted in my thread, and if you have any questions, just ask 
 
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Posted: #1807
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:

Don't worry Mikniks; while I do use the Bible some/often in my responses, I use other factual, credible reasons and answers as well. Although, I also showed, several times, how the Bible should be considered true and extremely credible, just strengthening the evidence even more. Just read what I have posted in my thread, and if you have any questions, just ask 

Regardless of what you think is evidence that the bible is true, the fact remains that until you prove god, you can NOT prove the bible...

Proving god proves the bible while the bible can not prove god...

THEREFORE, the bible is considered false until god is proven.  That's simple logic.
 
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Posted: #1808
That's simply opinionated, IMHO. Just read my thread, and if you have any questions, concerns, or comments, just ask  all of what we are talking about is addressed and answered in the thread
 
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Posted: #1809
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:

That's simply opinionated, IMHO. Just read my thread, and if you have any questions, concerns, or comments, just ask  all of what we are talking about is addressed and answered in the thread

It is not an opinion.  It is logic.  I can write a book about unicorns, but it is not proof that unicorns exist.  I first must prove unicorns exist, and only then will my book be considered valid...  

This is not an opinion.  Do you understand the explanation?

You can consider the bible true all you want, the fact remains it can not be used for an argument.
 
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Posted: #1810
I understand the explanation  Now, read my thread, and if you have any questions, concerns, comments after you read it, please ask
 
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Posted: #1811

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

Rostos, I say this with every fiber of my being...

You are the second DUMBEST person I have ever had the displeasure of talking to, and only because drake is number 1...

I said Santa exists?  No I did not.  Not only did I not say that, but it is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT...  The fact that you also think that that one little thing would PROVE Santa to be real shows what it takes for you to believe something...


You think the universe proves that there is a god?  The only thing the universe proves is that there is a universe...


Your stance is:  "You can't prove me wrong, so I must be right!"

OK well, I believe we all live in a computer program.  You can't prove me wrong, so I must be right...  Or is that testable Rostos?

you said there are presents that have never been accounted for..ie, no one bought it, no one donated it.....What does that mean? Where did the present come from if no one accounted for it? If you woke up one morning, found a present under your tree, no one in your family bought it or put it there, not one of your friends put it there, no one broke into house and put it there, then how did it get there????????

You are the one that said there are presents unaccounted for........

 
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Posted: #1812
Quote Originally Posted by Messier-11:

How bout Joseph's bad luck.....he stuck to anal and still got the bitch pregnant. That's the real mind boggler
This needs to be bumped from the front...
I'd rather be playing D&D.
 
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Posted: #1813
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:



I say this respectfully  but what are your motives for posting in this thread?
To challenge rank bullshit.
I'd rather be playing D&D.
 
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Posted: #1814

I meant hyprocrites from the standpoint that alot do not practice what they preach. Christianity itself is full of it... its how the protestant revolution began. Or would you change the rules of something that you believed was divine?

Christianity is suppose to be a religion of tolerance and understanding.... but some of the posts in this thread alone proves the point.

Sinners? sometimes its different...other times its the same

Think about the Popes that approved the killing of muslims during the crusades. Last time I looked didn't that break one of the ten commandments?

The biggest question that show ones ability is the ability to admit the possibility that they're wrong. Its certainly possibe that god exists.... however can any of you believers admit the possibility you're wrong?

Just keep in mind that if people didn't question the world would still be flat

 

 
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Posted: #1815
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:

I quoted that comment because of the "existence of God" part. I provide plenty of evidence that shows God's existence...

No you haven't.
Using the bible as proof of what the bible says is true is circular logic, and unfounded rhetoric.

While you may not need "proof" to establish a wish fantasy, many others prefer different standards, and are willing to use their brain to speculate with  a high degree accuracy, and rethink when information points to being wrong. The higher standards which many people require are the same standards which devised your technological comforts  you use everyday.

Progress that is both rapid enough to be noticed and stable enough to continue over many generations has been achieved only once in the history of our species. It began apx. the time of the scientific revolution, and is still underway. It has  included improvements not only in scientific understanding, but also in technology, political institutions, moral values, art, and every aspect of human welfare.

Whenever there has been human progress, there have been influential men who denied that it was genuine, that it was desirable, or even that the concept was meaningful.

There is indeed an objective difference between false explanation and a true one, between chronic failure to solve a problem and solving it, and also between wrong, and right, ugly, and beautiful, suffering, and its alleviation - thus stagnation and progress in the fullest sense.


 


I'd rather be playing D&D.
 
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Posted: #1816
Quote Originally Posted by jagerfury:


No you haven't.
Using the bible as proof of what the bible says is true is circular logic, and unfounded rhetoric.

While you may not need "proof" to establish a wish fantasy, many others prefer different standards, and are willing to use their brain to speculate with  a high degree accuracy, and rethink when information points to being wrong. The higher standards which many people require are the same standards which devised your technological comforts  you use everyday.

Progress that is both rapid enough to be noticed and stable enough to continue over many generations has been achieved only once in the history of our species. It began apx. the time of the scientific revolution, and is still underway. It has  included improvements not only in scientific understanding, but also in technology, political institutions, moral values, art, and every aspect of human welfare.

Whenever there has been human progress, there have been influential men who denied that it was genuine, that it was desirable, or even that the concept was meaningful.

There is indeed an objective difference between false explanation and a true one, between chronic failure to solve a problem and solving it, and also between wrong, and right, ugly, and beautiful, suffering, and its alleviation - thus stagnation and progress in the fullest sense.


 



Interesting comment, and I appreciate the response. I am actually at the golf course right now about to head back to work from lunch break, but when I get home ill expand a little on this. But, again, I use much more than just the Bible in my responses... but I have also shown how the Bible is in fact true, credible, and should be taken seriously. Read my thread and it'll hopefully help. The thing about technology and science, is that year after year, time after time, theories and discoveries are being discarded and changed, as should be assumed. But the Bible is, and has always been the same.... and will never change. Be back later to hopefully expand more on all of this. Hope everybody's having a good day so far 
 
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Posted: #1817
I will if my early P3 hits at Paaaaarx 2,3/1,2,3,4,5/2...
I'd rather be playing D&D.
 
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Posted: #1818
Quote Originally Posted by Rostos:

you said there are presents that have never been accounted for..ie, no one bought it, no one donated it.....What does that mean? Where did the present come from if no one accounted for it? If you woke up one morning, found a present under your tree, no one in your family bought it or put it there, not one of your friends put it there, no one broke into house and put it there, then how did it get there????????

You are the one that said there are presents unaccounted for........


WHY ARE YOU EVEN TALKING ABOUT PRESENTS? HOW IS THAT RELEVANT?

Seriously - why is it so hard for you to actually respond to posts?

ANSWER THIS QUESTION AND THIS QUESTION ONLY:

WE ARE ALL LIVING IN A COMPUTER PROGRAM. This is a FACT. Now prove me wrong.
 
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Posted: #1819
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:


WHY ARE YOU EVEN TALKING ABOUT PRESENTS? HOW IS THAT RELEVANT?

Seriously - why is it so hard for you to actually respond to posts?

ANSWER THIS QUESTION AND THIS QUESTION ONLY:

WE ARE ALL LIVING IN A COMPUTER PROGRAM. This is a FACT. Now prove me wrong.

Presents are the very essence of the proofs of Santa Claus...., It has EVERYTHING to do with the argument...Your friend Mikmiks said that there are presents unaacounted for......Do you realise the implications of this statement and what his thought process is...

Computer Programme? Are there ANY sign posts that poin to us living in a computer programme?

 
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Posted: #1820
Quote Originally Posted by Rostos:

Presents are the very essence of the proofs of Santa Claus...., It has EVERYTHING to do with the argument...Your friend Mikmiks said that there are presents unaacounted for......Do you realise the implications of this statement and what his thought process is...

Computer Programme? Are there ANY sign posts that poin to us living in a computer programme?



Firstly, I'm sure in the history of Christmas there has been at least ONE present that was received from an unknown source and that no one claimed to give to the recipient.  Understand now?  Probably not, and it doesn't matter!!!

Stop talking about Santa Claus!!  Stop talking about presents!!

THE POINT IS that there is just as much evidence supporting the idea that we live in a computer program as there is of a god existing...

Now please respond to what is relevant here:  We all live in a computer program.  Humans are batteries powering this computer.  PROVE ME WRONG...


I hope the use of colors helps you...
 
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Posted: #1821
Quote Originally Posted by Rostos:

Presents are the very essence of the proofs of Santa Claus...., It has EVERYTHING to do with the argument...Your friend Mikmiks said that there are presents unaacounted for......Do you realise the implications of this statement and what his thought process is...

Computer Programme? Are there ANY sign posts that poin to us living in a computer programme?


Ok-we're making progress now. You see how I said to you "we live in a computer program" and you responded by asking ME TO PROVIDE EVIDENCE.

Let's replace the statement "we live in a computer program" with "god exists." Surely you cannot fail to see the analogy now?

For the same reason that prompted you to ask me for evidence that we live in a computer program (as opposed to you providing me with evidence why we don't), I ask you for evidence as to why god exists (as opposed to me providing you with evidence as to why he doesn't).
 
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Posted: #1822

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:





Regardless, I've said it before in here, and I'll say it again: I WANT there to be a god, but I can't believe in something that has no evidence supporting it...  If you tell me unicorns are real, I won't believe you because there is no evidence...

I have never read anywhere on this thread where you said, "I want there to be a God"..... ever on this thread.

 The very first thing that came out of your mouth was, "Hey Rostos, something can come from nothing."

You have been trying your best to discredit or ridicule the existence of God all along. Below are some of the statements you've made. It clearly doesn't sound like a guy that's seeking and "wants there to be a God".

pg. 48 #1200, "Hey Rostos, something can come from nothing."

pg. 53 #1301, "Evil exists, AND"god" is all good and all powerful...This statement is contradictory. If "god" is all good, he would not allow evil to exist. If he is all powerful, that would mean he clearly has the power to abolish all evil...THEREFORE god can NOT be both all good AND all powerful..."

pg. 54 #1336 "So an all good god allows evil?? What an asshole...All it takes is simple logic to see the statement is contradictory, but if you believe in god, then you have already decided to go against simple logic, and I can not help you...Honestly, I wish I believed in a magical man in the sky, but my brain won't allow such foolishness."


pg. 54 #1341, "What is your excuse for "god" allowing people to die from natural disasters?? How is that okay? He just lets earthquakes and hurricanes kill millions... That's nice of him...There are very few people who TRULY believe in god.One of my favorite quotes: "Everybody want go heaven, but nobody want dead!" (funny enough it's from a Steven Seagal movie)... If people truly believed, they wouldn't be afraid to die....Are you afraid to die Rostos?"


pg. 54 #1349, "How can you speculate that if statistically the greatest fear for almost everyone is death??And if I die and there is a god, he can just forgive me for using the brain he gave me... Or is he too much of an asshole?

pg. 55 #1352, "You are aware that Adam never existed right? The story of Adam and Eve is just that: a story... You can't pick a choose stuff in the bible in an attempt to make your case... Why aren't you out killing people who are involved with banking and eating lobsters?? Those are forbidden in the bible, so wouldn't that be god's will??

pg. 55 #1367, "Oh I thought thou shall not murder? Bible says to kill a LOT... And Rostos, you clearly don't understand me... If you TRULY believe in god and heaven, then you should not be afraid to die... If you TRULY believe you are going to heaven, then why be scared to die??

pg. 56 #1379, "Drake, please stop saying that you KNOW that god is good or that you KNOW anything at all. The point is you KNOW NOTHING. Nobody KNOWS anything. And dont post some BS scripture that shows how you KNOW anything. The truth is no one KNOWS anything, because no one can KNOW. All you have is what you THINK is right... That you can not disprove... And I'm not claiming I know anything either. The fact of the matter is that NOBODY KNOWS ANYTHING... If you can't at least admit that, then I'm done here..."

pg. 58 #1440, "Actually I know a lot about the Catholic faith. I attended Catholic school for almost 15 years. The funny thing is, the more I learned, the more illogical it all seemed. So you "see" god huh? What's he/she look like?"

pg. 58 #1444, "You're worse than Rostos. Maybe what he did can be considered committing suicide. He knew people would kill him if he continued on his path. That's essentially euthanasia, no? He basically asked to be killed... "

pg. 59 #1457, "Kindergarten to high school senior is 15 years. It's actually 16 because my preschool was Catholic as well... I did pay attention. Like I said, the more I learned, the more illogical it all became..."

pg. 61 #1506, "Bible also says to kill people..."

pg. 64 #1585, "And I'm just curious Rostos... Let's say, hypothetically of course, that I wanted to live a christian life and attempt to repent for my sins, but I can't bring myself to believe in what I'm doing and all I can do is fake it... Does this count?... If not, how is it fair that god gave me a brain that doesn't allow me logically to believe in him... Then what? I go to hell because he gave me a brain that won't allow me to believe?? Or is faking it okay??"

So there is really nothing we can say to you at this point because you have a hardened heart and a stubborn closed mind. What you need is some kind of miracle in your life.

EX4life said it best on pg. 51 #1267 when he said, "The question everybody needs to ask themselves, is do you want there to be a God? If you say yes, then there is enough evidence, proof, and historical facts (Not that you necessarily need them to be a Christian) to back what the Bible says... but if you don't want there to be a God, is there truly anything anybody can say, even if God was to send His only Son to earth to save mankind, to get you to change your mind? I doubt it..."

 

 
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Posted: #1823
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:


Ok-we're making progress now. You see how I said to you "we live in a computer program" and you responded by asking ME TO PROVIDE EVIDENCE.

Let's replace the statement "we live in a computer program" with "god exists." Surely you cannot fail to see the analogy now?

For the same reason that prompted you to ask me for evidence that we live in a computer program (as opposed to you providing me with evidence why we don't), I ask you for evidence as to why god exists (as opposed to me providing you with evidence as to why he doesn't).

I have adequately done so in the thread I started a while back, named "Christianity Continued"... As I've said in the past, theres a ton of information within that thread, but it answers most, if not all of the questions that have been presented. I hope it helps. And if you have any questions, please feel free to ask 
 
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Posted: #1824
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:



I don't think everyone knows deep down inside that there is a god.  I think people WANT to believe in god.  I'm one of those people.  I wish I did believe in god, I just can't...

What about this drake?  I find it funny that you stopped copying my posts until this one...  You'll do anything in an attempt to make a point...
 
 
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Posted: #1825
Quote Originally Posted by EX4life:


I have adequately done so in the thread I started a while back, named "Christianity Continued"... As I've said in the past, theres a ton of information within that thread, but it answers most, if not all of the questions that have been presented. I hope it helps. And if you have any questions, please feel free to ask 

Stop saying that you answered all the questions.  These answers are merely your opinion.  I would think if there was actual evidence and answers the religious community would be telling everyone about it....
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