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Proof that there is no god.

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RJSmith

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Joined: Apr, 2007

Posts: 7618

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 12:01 PM ET #326

Quote Originally Posted by SYSTEM:

wrong, what we're saying (if I can speak for you kitty) is that we don't know, but we learn more an more each day through science. you on the other hand don't know, but would rather take the easy way out (not think) and say the magic man in the sky did it...

Exactly.
Through science human kind/life has developed/improved in so many areas - and we still do.
Religion is staus quo. We know everything, we have the truth - this is why scientists have been persecuted by religion for thousands of years - and still are.

That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence

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SirJohnDrake

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 1:54 PM ET #327

Quote Posted by cd:

Been trying to tell these guys thru out this whole thread, that its an impossible question neither side can answer, but yet both sides keep going back and forth like they are right.

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That is not what we are trying to do...don't you think I know that both sides can't prove which side is right?

What brother Rostos and I are trying to do is to enlighten these non-believers and have them converted so that they too can be saved oneday.

We are disciples of Jesus Christ who commanded His disciples to spread the Good News and what better place to try to spread it here at covers.com where I wouldn't hesitate to boldly say that probably 70% or more are atheists.

Right now I'm not using too much of the Holy Bible because these guys really hate anything coming from the bible. To them it is all man-made lies but rather I'm using a logical process to help them see that the belief in God is really not so outlandish at all as many of them believe.

There are many strong points that can be described philosophically, scientifically and biblically to help one consider leaning towards the belief in God but like I mentioned above I'm not using too much of the biblical points of view.

So please bear with us, this thread won't last forever.

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Ktrain

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Posts: 6580

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 2:08 PM ET #328

My exact problem with religion, not the possibility of a God, can be found in SJD's second paragraph in the post above.

Stop trying to convert people. Just stop. I have never come across atheist knocking on my door trying to change my way of thinking to something that lacks solid proof and evidence. In fact, I've never had an atheist knock my door randomly.

This is my problem with religion. If there is a God, and he wants me to subscribe to a specific religion(whichever one that may be) than I'm sure he will tell me, or send a signal, or burn a bush, or send a messenger, or anything like that.

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KittyKatz286

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Posts: 1988

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 2:11 PM ET #329

That might be the most sensical post sjd has ever made. But there is nothing short of God himself that could convince me there is even a chance he exists...and we're talking mere existence here, let alone that we even have a clue what hes like.

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SirJohnDrake

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 2:14 PM ET #330

Quote Posted by ktrain:

Stop trying to convert people. Just stop. I have never come across atheist knocking on my door trying to change my way of thinking to something that lacks solid proof and evidence. In fact, I've never had an atheist knock my door randomly.
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I have a better idea...why don't you just stop coming here to this thread...won't that work for you?

Furthermore you think I'm going to listen to you over our Lord Savior Jesus Christ who has told us to spread the Good News?

You don't like it stop coming here simple as that.

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CRRECORDS

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Posts: 781

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 3:26 PM ET #331

brother sjd, do you eat pork products? I am not sure what to do. I have read matthew 15:11

What goes into a man's mouth does not make him 'unclean,' but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him 'unclean.'"

but joel osteen has quoted God saying swine is unclean......

In Genesis , Chapter Four, Eve bears Cain and Abel. 'And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.' That 'but' in the middle of the sentence is the first clue to disapproval. This disapproval is confirmed by verses three to five. Abel and Cain bring offerings to God: Abel of his sheep and Cain, the fruits of the ground. God, we are told, had respect for Abel's carnivorous offering, but He had no respect for Cain's vegetarian one.

joelosteen

should i just eat sheep to please the lord?

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Ktrain

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 3:28 PM ET #332

I can stop posting here but that wont stop Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses from knocking on my door, especially when football is on.

Asking me to stop coming in here is the same as me asking you to stop spreading your thoughts of religion. Seems a bit hypocritical of you to tell me to stop posing in here if you are going to continue to post your pro religion thoughts.

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SYSTEM

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Posts: 1687

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 3:30 PM ET #333

Quote Originally Posted by SirJohnDrake:

Quote Posted by ktrain:

Stop trying to convert people. Just stop. I have never come across atheist knocking on my door trying to change my way of thinking to something that lacks solid proof and evidence. In fact, I've never had an atheist knock my door randomly.
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I have a better idea...why don't you just stop coming here to this thread...won't that work for you?

Furthermore you think I'm going to listen to you over our Lord Savior Jesus Christ who has told us to spread the Good News?

You don't like it stop coming here simple as that.

why do you only listen to and do some things the "lord savior jesus christ" has asked you to do?

stop being a hypocrite, you don't truly believe...

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AgentCooper

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Joined: Nov, 2009

Posts: 200

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 4:09 PM ET #334

Zeus is the one true god and creator of the universe. Anybody that says different is ignorant.

And Jesus was a real man who DID exist, however he was black, not the blonde haired hippy looking dude who all the heathens believe in.

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lovethedough

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 4:16 PM ET #335

I believe in God. But I once saw a video of a fire that killed a bunch of people at a bar in Rhode Island. A guy caught the whole fire on tape, and the video was going around the internet. Terrible tragedy. Makes you wonder?

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AgentCooper

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 4:25 PM ET #336

A question for the believers (who we all know ONLY believe this stuff cuz it was beaten into their heads by their parents):

Say I meet a monk who has spent his entire life living in self-imposed poverty, seeking inner peace. I have a conversation with him about Jesus and hand him a bible. He hands it back and politely explains that it is not his belief and he goes on his way. Are you saying that this man, now having been made aware of the Christian religion, will go to hell because he chooses not to believe, even tho he's lived as peaceful a life as any person can? If you're going to believe in a god, why a mean god like that?

The non-believers here don't give two shits what anybody is choosing to believe in. Hell, we're even admitting that it's possible there IS a god! What is killing us tho are the ridiculous statements the believers are making. They're assuming to know, with tremendously huge balls, god's plan. THAT's what people can't stand about religion. It's what it DOES to people that piss rational-minded people off. There are plenty of good people who have used religion to do good things for humanity. Then there are scumbags like Joel Osteen who use it to amass extraordinary wealth.

If you're a true true believer why are you posting about it on Covers? Why are you not in some desolate part of the world helping the needy? See, I don't need to do that because I don't subscribe to a religion that calls on me to do that. But you believers really don't seem to be following the teachings of your own savior.

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ClubDirt

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 4:36 PM ET #337

Quote Originally Posted by AgentCooper:

A question for the believers (who we all know ONLY believe this stuff cuz it was beaten into their heads by their parents):

Say I meet a monk who has spent his entire life living in self-imposed poverty, seeking inner peace. I have a conversation with him about Jesus and hand him a bible. He hands it back and politely explains that it is not his belief and he goes on his way. Are you saying that this man, now having been made aware of the Christian religion, will go to hell because he chooses not to believe, even tho he's lived as peaceful a life as any person can? If you're going to believe in a god, why a mean god like that?

The non-believers here don't give two shits what anybody is choosing to believe in. Hell, we're even admitting that it's possible there IS a god! What is killing us tho are the ridiculous statements the believers are making. They're assuming to know, with tremendously huge balls, god's plan. THAT's what people can't stand about religion. It's what it DOES to people that piss rational-minded people off. There are plenty of good people who have used religion to do good things for humanity. Then there are scumbags like Joel Osteen who use it to amass extraordinary wealth.

If you're a true true believer why are you posting about it on Covers? Why are you not in some desolate part of the world helping the needy? See, I don't need to do that because I don't subscribe to a religion that calls on me to do that. But you believers really don't seem to be following the teachings of your own savior.

jesus would be in church, raising money for a good cause.

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SirJohnDrake

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 5:08 PM ET #338

Quote Posted by kitty:

That might be the most sensical post sjd has ever made.

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What?...a compliment and a putdown all in one sentence?...hihihihi!

I don't know whether to thank you or tell you why don't you go knock on ktrain's door and tell him you're an atheist...lol

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SYSTEM

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Posts: 1687

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 5:25 PM ET #339

Quote Originally Posted by ClubDirt:

jesus would be in church, raising money for a good cause.

good to see people doing the lords work

i'm sure sjd will get out his checkbook for this worthy cause...

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SirJohnDrake

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Posts: 14746

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 5:31 PM ET #340

Quote Posted by Cr:

should i just eat sheep to please the lord?

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There is something better for you to do first. Confess to the Lord you're a sinner and ask for forgiveness and then accept Jesus Christ as your Lord Savior. If you have already done that before well good for you!

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KittyKatz286

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Joined: Feb, 2009

Posts: 1988

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 7:00 PM ET #341

Quote Originally Posted by SirJohnDrake:

Quote Posted by Cr:

should i just eat sheep to please the lord?

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There is something better for you to do first. Confess to the Lord you're a sinner and ask for forgiveness and then accept Jesus Christ as your Lord Savior. If you have already done that before well good for you!

At which point, CR, I'd also recommend you go see a psychiatrist. Anyone who has conversations with dead people and isn't haley joel osment should probably get their head examined.

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cd329

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 7:34 PM ET #342

Sir John, you really shouldnt be trying to convert people, because theres no way our side can prove God exists. Believing that God exists or doest exist, is something that each person needs to figure out for themselves. I believe in God, but theres nothing i can tell Ktrain to make him believe what i believe, because i have no proof am right.

Everybodys heart needs to find God or not find God themselves

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CRRECORDS

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Posts: 781

Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 7:46 PM ET #343

Brother Sjd, if i accept jesus christ as my lord and savior will I be able to do this as it is written in the new testament?

Mark 16:18

they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."

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SirJohnDrake

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 8:27 PM ET #344

Quote Posted by AgentCooper:

Say I meet a monk who has spent his entire life living in self-imposed poverty, seeking inner peace. I have a conversation with him about Jesus and hand him a bible. He hands it back and politely explains that it is not his belief and he goes on his way. Are you saying that this man, now having been made aware of the Christian religion, will go to hell because he chooses not to believe, even tho he's lived as peaceful a life as any person can? If you're going to believe in a god, why a mean god like that?

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This monk that you described as being a good person is still a sinner like everyone else and so the only way he can be saved is to repent his sins, ask for forgiveness and except Jesus Christ as his Lord Savior.

In order to receive forgiveness, we need to place our trust in Christ as our Savior and the Lord of our lives.

But if we reject Christ, then we reject God's mercy and fall back on His justice. And you know where you stand there. If we reject Jesus' offer of forgiveness, then there is simply is no one else to pay the penalty for your sin--except yourself.

Thus, in a sense, God doesn't send anybody to hell. His desire is that everyone be saved, and He pleads with people to come to Him.

But if we reject Christ's sacrifice for our sin, then God has no choice but to give us what we deserve.

God will not send us to hell--but we will send ourselves. Our eternal destiny thus lies in our own hands. It is a matter of our free choice where we shall spend eternity.

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KittyKatz286

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 8:30 PM ET #345

Why is the monk a sinner? CR created the situation and did not say he was a sinner. You cannot create facts.

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Rostos

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Posted: Jul. 17, 2012 - 9:16 PM ET #346

Quote Originally Posted by AgentCooper:

A question for the believers (who we all know ONLY believe this stuff cuz it was beaten into their heads by their parents):

Genetic fallacy dude...What about non believers that have turned into believers in their 20s, 30s etc etc?

Say I meet a monk who has spent his entire life living in self-imposed poverty, seeking inner peace. I have a conversation with him about Jesus and hand him a bible. He hands it back and politely explains that it is not his belief and he goes on his way. Are you saying that this man, now having been made aware of the Christian religion, will go to hell because he chooses not to believe, even tho he's lived as peaceful a life as any person can? If you're going to believe in a god, why a mean god like that?

How many times do we have to explain it to you? DO NOT JUDGE ANYONE. NO ONE KNOWS WHO GOES TO HELL. NO ONE. STOP TRYING TO DETERMINE WHO GOES WHERE. Jesus specifically said , "DO NOT JUDGE".

The non-believers here don't give two shits what anybody is choosing to believe in. Hell, we're even admitting that it's possible there IS a god! What is killing us tho are the ridiculous statements the believers are making. They're assuming to know, with tremendously huge balls, god's plan. THAT's what people can't stand about religion. It's what it DOES to people that piss rational-minded people off. There are plenty of good people who have used religion to do good things for humanity. Then there are scumbags like Joel Osteen who use it to amass extraordinary wealth.

Who is making a statement that they know Gods plan? Who Give evidence...

If you're a true true believer why are you posting about it on Covers? Why are you not in some desolate part of the world helping the needy? See, I don't need to do that because I don't subscribe to a religion that calls on me to do that. But you believers really don't seem to be following the teachings of your own savior.

Who started this thread? The bible tells us to DEFEND our faith. Have we started threads saying, "repent or you will go to hell" Or "believe or you are going to hell"....No, we are simply defending our faith. Furthermore, how do you know what charitable works posters here do and dont?