Covid-19 Good And Bad

Ontario announces vaccine passport.

As of September 22, Ontario will become a "papers please" jurisdiction.  Proof of vaccination will need to be shown to enter dine in restaurants, gyms, movie theaters, conference/event halls, sports stadiums, concerts and the like. 

Welcome to authoritarianism.  Now you know how so many germans supported the Nazis and why so many russians supported to commies

The Ontario government responded because of a lethally dangerous surge in COVID-19 cases.  Hospitals are being overwhelmed and people are dying despite your lack of empathy for the victims.

So far, ivermectin studies have been flawed and unreliable according to the journal.ie.  Better research is needed.  Conspiracy theorists claim ivermectin has been proven to work and that drug companies are depriving the public of a cheap cure.  But co-inventor of ivermectin and drug maker Merck have doubts about ivermectin effectiveness and safety in treating covid patients.  US center for disease control and World health organization don't recommend ivermectin.   Food drug administration and European medicine agency reject ivermectin as covid treatment. 

I asked my Trump supporting neighbor if she was taking Ivermectin to prevent getting covid.

She stomped once for Yes.

In addition to masks and social distancing, vaccine passports also help to safely reopen economy without lockdowns.  Another reason to get vaccinated.   No vaccine passport required at grocery and retail stores.  Worldwide, increasing number of countries are implementing vaccine passports.  Especially for air travel, hospitals and colleges.  Necessity is the mother of invention.  Private sector seems to want proof of vaccination more than government. The common good is more important than personal freedom in a pandemic.

Listen to the science community, not to the ideological misinformation. 

Please do NOT inject disinfectant to fight Covid-19. 

ESPN reports former Alabama football OT and asst. coach, Jim Fuller, age 76,  has died of covid complications.

WHAT THEY PURPOSELY OMMITTED WAS THAT FULLER WAS FULLY VACCINATED. 

SEE HOW THEY ROLL??

Boom....spice right here.... repackage ivermectin as "new" patent drug with a little recipe tweak and Big Pharma is BACK IN BUSINESS....seriously, can't make this shit up.  

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/pfizer-starts-dosing-patients-oral-covid-19-drug-trial-2021-09-01/

There are a couple copy & paste bots around here that only understand copy & paste so they might miss that link....

Sept 1 (Reuters) - Pfizer Inc (PFE.N) and Merck & Co Inc (MRK.N) announced on Wednesday new trials of their experimental oral antiviral drugs for COVID-19 as the race to develop an easy-to-administer treatment for the potentially fatal illness heats up. 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7539925/

You can actually re-establish a drug patent if you find a new use for it substantially different than it's intended use. If Ivermectin was found to be a legitimate treatment for covid 19, it's original patent holder could refile and it would cease to be generic. The same goes for HCQ. Antiviral therapies are incredibly tricky. I firmly believe HCQ could've been a potential game changer that should have been researched more thoroughly, as it is one of the more successful antivirals in history. I have a hard time getting behind an antiparasitic.

Can anyone here direct the forum to links to credible sources announcing a brand new vaccine (within past 4 months only) that has been developed *SPECIFICALLY* for the DELTA variant that mutated from the original strain of covid?

This would be important since so many people IN AMERICA are being hospitalized and dying from *DELTA* (not the original strain) which OBVIOUSLY is different.

I heard news they were working on it, but as we all know this takes considerable time. Then we would need to get everyone vaccinated with the BRAND NEW "DELTA" VACCINE designed SPECIFICALLY to protect against DELTA.  That will take a lot more time.

To my knowledge as of September 2, the only vaccine we have currently is the trump-vaccine --- developed in labs in 2020 for the ORIGINAL STRAIN of  Covid-19.  Even then, the trump-vaccine was never promised to be 100% efficacy.  Initially they said between 90% and 95% - noting there would still be "breakthrough" illnesses.

However, with the mutation of that virus into DELTA-variant, now 99% of all cases in US, it's a whole new ballgame, according to health experts. Luckily,  even though the trump-vaccine was never developed for DELTA we are fortunate that studies show it still offers fairly decent protection from DELTA -- in the range of about 66%

Not great obviously, but clearly better than nothing, since there currently is no vaccine yet available that was designed specifically for DELTA to my knowledge.

In other parts of the world where DELTA is not yet fully dominant like here, the trump vaccines offer much higher efficay against the ORIGINAL STRAIN of covid for which they were specifically developed.

@fubah2

 I'll do some searching. I always assumed it would be a one shot booster. Now you've gotten the better of my curiosity.

Ok.

The one shot booster which Dr.Fauci has mentioned a few times "might" be needed

of course was well BEFORE *DELTA* encompassed 99% of all known cases in US, and therefore the booster was applicable to ORIGINAL STRAIN of covid.  Although word of a "booster shot" is still mentioned now that DELTA has replaced the original strain, one wonders how much more effective it might raise protection from just the 66% we have now.

And of course, not understood by most is that DELTA itself is mutating!  Tiny mutations within the DELTA strain will obviously render any vaccine slightly less effective, and that efficacy will drop further over time and further mutations -- even though scientists may still refer to it as DELTA until it has mutates so significantly that they rename it.

In those who are FULLY VACCINATED against the ORIGINAL STRAIN of covid-19, deaths are rare, but *DO* occur because the trump-vaccine developed for that strain is only 90-95% effective. So there's those 5-10% fully vaccinated who will be unlucky. This was always known and explained many, many, MANY TIMES OVER to the public before......well at least in the major papers and on both MSNBC and CNN. Don't know if FOX NEWS or other rightwing partisan media explained the facts to their followers.

However, there are NOW  somewhat higher rates of hospitalizations and deaths in Americans FULLY VACCINATED against the ORIGINAL STRAIN of covid-19  because they are getting INFECTED WITH *DELTA* - which the trump-vaccine was NOT developed against (DELTA only evolved this year)

Less educated people across American get easily confused, especially those who follow news sources that present only rightwing partisan views.  They think (wrongly) that Covid-19:"the original strain from last year" and Covid-19: "the new DELTA-strain" are THE SAME THING since they are both routinely called Covid.  But this false.  DELTA is far more contagious for one, and more aggressive on health to all ages, promoting more severity in symptoms.  Logically this can be expected from any mutation.  And we are being warned DELTA will mutate further

Less educated people across American get easily confused, especially those who follow news sources that present only rightwing partisan views. They think (wrongly) that Covid-19:"the original strain from last year" and Covid-19: "the new DELTA-strain" are THE SAME THING since they are both routinely called Covid. But this false. DELTA is far more contagious for one, and more aggressive on health to all ages, promoting more severity in symptoms. Logically this can be expected from any mutation. And we are being warned DELTA will mutate further

If one is to educate, and if we want to get really technical, COVID-19 is not a strain of coronavirus. It's the name applied to disease caused by the SARS-Cov2 strains of coronaviruses, so named for their similarity to the SARS-CoV1 strains of coronaviruses, in that they both cause SARS. COVID-19 is a catch-all term that simply means you contracted the SARS-CoV2 virus, and should have only ever been applied to those who exhibited some, or at least one of the established symptoms. I haven't read up on the Delta Variant as much as I should but am curious if it constitutes enough of a mutation to be classified a new strain altogether. It is clearly part of the deadlier SARS causing class of coronaviruses as opposed to those that cause common colds akin to rhinoviruses. However it exhibits much differently than the variants we have all become accustomed to. Gone are the loss of taste/smell, the fevers, etc.  They have been replaced with symptoms mimicking allergies or the aforementioned common cold. Sniffles, nasal congestion, etc were not a common symptom of the original variant yet is quite common with the Delta. This is surprising as the Delta Variant doesn't always show itself in the nasal cavity, rendering the most common tests useless. Scary stuff. People need to be vigilant. And if you are feeling sick, even if you have tested negative, isolate.

@fubah2

 We're going to trivia night for the first time in a couple months but when I get home, I'm going to do some reading on the Delta Variant. This virus is perfecting itself. Scary stuff. With the Delta, you could exhibit no symptoms and test negative via nasal swab all as it attacks the lungs. You go from no symptoms, to shortness of breath, to a ventilator.

The people getting prescriptions for ivermectin instead of the vaccine because of Big Pharma better not find out who's making that ivermectin.

very good points fubah

i see what u  r getting at ::  we can be fully vaccinated against the measles but get infected with diptheria  or common inluenza and  still suffer severe illness and possibly death

any given vaccine is not intended to b a cure all for every virus or mutation . its simply impossible  and that applies to delta

Ivermectin in a nutshell!

Andrew Torba: When someone uses the “muh horse paste” logical fallacy while discussing Ivermectin respond with: - The Donald - America First! (patriots.win)

In any given flu year, 66% would be considered a pretty successful vaccine. I never get flu vaccines. Not since my youth, probably some 30 years ago. I haven't had the flu in that time either. I have a strong immune system. Here's the rub though. I, like most people, have had a flu shot in my life. And it probably helped springboard the immunity I enjoy today. Not only that, but if you live an active life as I do, you are constantly bombarded with influenza. Your immune system is getting a workout. Covid-19, while coronaviruses account for upwards of 20-30% of common colds, most people haven't been exposed to this class of coronaviruses  substantially to truly build up an immunity. There will be those who choose to never be vaccinated. Someone of those will build a strong natural immunity. However, in order to build a true herd immunity, some people need to be vaccinated. The majority of people. Whether you consider majority 60%, 70%, whatever, it needs to be achieved. So if you're against vaccines, that's fine. If you are apprehensive about an experimental vaccine, hey, I respect that but just be clear, for you to have any semblance of a normal life, somebody has to bite the bullet.

secret hint for those who listen only to rightwing media :: big pharma makes ivermectin too

antibodies buildup from personal immunity is great but only when those antibodies we have r specific to the exact version of viral disease , which explains in largest part why we r advised to get a new influenza vaccine every year .influenza virus mutates so we need a new vaccine      or we can take r chances

my immunity antibodies from the measles vaccines will not protect me from diptheria or other contagious diseases

per fubahs point which i agree , immunity antibodies we have built up in ourselves and also in the population r fine against the original covid-19 genomes when we were exposed (or the vaccine for that)      but we should not expect those immunities to provide full protection against resulting mutations ,like delta ,  and so far this is proving to b the case .  delta is everywhere now but only on the scene since the early spring . most of our immunities including those built with the original strain vaccine r just immunity for the original strain of covid -- not delta

as fuabh said we r so far lucky that there is a some overlap and getting some measure of protection against delta but its less effective protection than against original strain because of the mutations .  and its mutating more every day .

iow most of the immunity in america today ,either from being infected bfor or from the rump-vaccines, is immunity specific to the original strain . its going to take many months longer to produce herd immunity specific to DELTA . maybe another yr !  but it will certainly mutate so much by then we will have a new virus to contend with and have to start all over .our personal immunity today from original strain of covid wont protect against measles , diptheria , or the next mutation of covid which is coming soon . its gloomy  and it totally sucks

ya 66% delta protection ( from the rump-vaccines )  is better than most yrs with influenza vaccines      but then except for children we adults have built up influenza antibodies which provide some resistance to the common flu so that even if we get it  then for most people its just a few really horrible days in bed then its gone with no lasting aftereffects      but influenza is no where near as deadly as original strain of covid    and  DELTA is even worse !

Ivermectin has been around long enough for the patent to run out, meaning most ivermectin on the market is cheap generic. A cheap, generic antiparasitic. Not an antiviral. It has shown potential as an antiviral though so who knows.